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Author Topic: our wood stoves are horrible but epa thinks this is fine  (Read 71863 times)

Jwood

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Re: our wood stoves are horrible but epa thinks this is fine
« Reply #150 on: April 21, 2014, 08:44:17 PM »

You said we are impacting the planet to raise temps, so what would you say caused it for the 150 years of the Roman period, vehicles factories and the burning of fossil fuels. I just don't know what else could possibly cause it?
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Sloppy_Snood

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Re: our wood stoves are horrible but epa thinks this is fine
« Reply #151 on: April 21, 2014, 08:46:54 PM »

Actually I was insinuating more along the lines of cellulosic ethanol (which isn't methanol), which is made from wood products. 

....ah.... now I understand that reference.  I was thinking more along the lines of moonshine production in the Midwest (where un-experienced moonshiners generally injure people by not monitoring their distillations closely enough and do not remove ALL of the methanol from the fermented in-process broth).

You are not making any sense.  Neal

Not really but I acknowledge that you are not following (my previous global warming posts in the other thread pretty much explain my viewpoint so I will not bore others with reiteration).
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Re: our wood stoves are horrible but epa thinks this is fine
« Reply #152 on: April 21, 2014, 08:49:48 PM »

You said we are impacting the planet to raise temps, so what would you say caused it for the 150 years of the Roman period, vehicles factories and the burning of fossil fuels. I just don't know what else could possibly cause it?
Well I am gonna go with natural phenomena as a solid guess.  However now, unlike then, we have much more sophisticated data collection abilities as well as better climate understandings.

Do you contend that only either natural, or anthropogenic processes can happen at a time? 

Neal
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Re: our wood stoves are horrible but epa thinks this is fine
« Reply #153 on: April 21, 2014, 08:52:20 PM »

Actually I was insinuating more along the lines of cellulosic ethanol (which isn't methanol), which is made from wood products. 

....ah.... now I understand that reference.  I was thinking more along the lines of moonshine production in the Midwest (where un-experienced moonshiners generally injure people by not monitoring their distillations closely enough and do not remove ALL of the methanol from the fermented in-process broth).

You are not making any sense.  Neal

Not really but I acknowledge that you are not following (my previous global warming posts in the other thread pretty much explain my viewpoint so I will not bore others with reiteration).
No problem.   :thumbup:

Ok, and I am not following, because as previously stated, you are not making sense.

Neal
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Sloppy_Snood

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Re: our wood stoves are horrible but epa thinks this is fine
« Reply #154 on: April 21, 2014, 08:52:44 PM »

Well I am gonna go with natural phenomena as a solid guess.  However now, unlike then, we have much more sophisticated data collection abilities as well as better climate understandings.

Well if that ain't some good data to support Bovine Flatulence Global Warming theory, I don't know what is!  ::)

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Re: our wood stoves are horrible but epa thinks this is fine
« Reply #155 on: April 21, 2014, 08:54:46 PM »

Well I am gonna go with natural phenomena as a solid guess.  However now, unlike then, we have much more sophisticated data collection abilities as well as better climate understandings.

Well if that ain't some good data to support Bovine Flatulence Global Warming theory, I don't know what is!  ::)
Again, this post is senseless.

You seem to indicate that we don't really have a more sophisticated understanding of our climate now than we did in the times of the Roman empire.  Surely you don't believe that...

Neal
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Jwood

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Re: our wood stoves are horrible but epa thinks this is fine
« Reply #156 on: April 21, 2014, 08:56:27 PM »

No Neal what I'm saying is there is no concrete evidence that humans burning fossil fuels is the reason for climate change that's all.
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Re: our wood stoves are horrible but epa thinks this is fine
« Reply #157 on: April 21, 2014, 09:01:38 PM »

No Neal what I'm saying is there is no concrete evidence that humans burning fossil fuels is the reason for climate change that's all.
Ok, so they why not argue that, instead of arguing some pointless crap about cars in the Roman empire?

Neal
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Jwood

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Re: our wood stoves are horrible but epa thinks this is fine
« Reply #158 on: April 21, 2014, 09:04:58 PM »

Well I was in a round about way didn't think it was that hard to figure out the Romans had a pretty big warm period without fossil fuel usage.
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Re: our wood stoves are horrible but epa thinks this is fine
« Reply #159 on: April 21, 2014, 09:56:26 PM »

Just remember Neal this debate is all in fun no hard feelings!
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Sloppy_Snood

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Re: our wood stoves are horrible but epa thinks this is fine
« Reply #160 on: April 22, 2014, 08:02:20 AM »

Well if that ain't some good data to support Bovine Flatulence Global Warming theory, I don't know what is!  ::)
Again, this post is senseless.

You seem to indicate that we don't really have a more sophisticated understanding of our climate now than we did in the times of the Roman empire.  Surely you don't believe that... Neal

Senseless?... uh,, no.  A little silly? ... perhaps.  But perhaps you are not making the connection.

The reference is this:  the U.S. Federal government has spent an excessive amount of U.S. taxpayer cash on the study of the environmental impact of methane directly sourced from bovine flatulence on the planet and its impact on the pseudo-claim of global warming.  Pardon my language but the studies and the bovine anus has 1 thing in common: they are both full of *&$t (no study needed for determination).

Sophistication understanding?  No.  Scientific understanding?  Yes.  But as much with my beloved science, much cannot be detected through scientific methodology (e.g. slice a human cadaver into as many thin slies as a meat slicer can and I doubt you will ever "find" the human soul).

As a scientist (chemist actually), my lack of belief in any of the so-called data you are presenting on global warming is based on estimates (fancy name for educated guessing) is that you want to extrapolate 20, 50, 100, whatever years of data (post-discovery of precise and accurate temperature-measuring devices) as an isolated phenomenon (problem; issue; man is killing the earth; yada, yada, yada) when the millions of years old mother Earth lifecycle is 1,000,000s+ percent longer than the data study or a human's lifecycle to measure it.  In reality, it means little to nothing.  The earth is doing just fine without spending money to "save it" from the global warming non-issue. ;)
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Re: our wood stoves are horrible but epa thinks this is fine
« Reply #161 on: April 22, 2014, 09:46:06 AM »

Well if that ain't some good data to support Bovine Flatulence Global Warming theory, I don't know what is!  ::)
Again, this post is senseless.

You seem to indicate that we don't really have a more sophisticated understanding of our climate now than we did in the times of the Roman empire.  Surely you don't believe that... Neal

Senseless?... uh,, no.  A little silly? ... perhaps.  But perhaps you are not making the connection.

The reference is this:  the U.S. Federal government has spent an excessive amount of U.S. taxpayer cash on the study of the environmental impact of methane directly sourced from bovine flatulence on the planet and its impact on the pseudo-claim of global warming.  Pardon my language but the studies and the bovine anus has 1 thing in common: they are both full of *&$t (no study needed for determination).

Sophistication understanding?  No.  Scientific understanding?  Yes.  But as much with my beloved science, much cannot be detected through scientific methodology (e.g. slice a human cadaver into as many thin slies as a meat slicer can and I doubt you will ever "find" the human soul).

As a scientist (chemist actually), my lack of belief in any of the so-called data you are presenting on global warming is based on estimates (fancy name for educated guessing) is that you want to extrapolate 20, 50, 100, whatever years of data (post-discovery of precise and accurate temperature-measuring devices) as an isolated phenomenon (problem; issue; man is killing the earth; yada, yada, yada) when the millions of years old mother Earth lifecycle is 1,000,000s+ percent longer than the data study or a human's lifecycle to measure it.  In reality, it means little to nothing.  The earth is doing just fine without spending money to "save it" from the global warming non-issue. ;)
Your post is complete and udder crap.

1.  It makes perfect scientific sense to study all causes of the warming, cow farts included.  Humans have domesticated massive amounts of cows.  Methane is a known GHG, and the amount that the domestication of livestock impacts our climate is certainly a legitimate study topic.  You are being highly ignorant on this issue.

2.  Yes, sophisticated understanding, that comes from continued scientific discoveries, made by studying (cow farts included).  Again, you are showing a large amount of ignorance if you think our understanding of the climate is not more sophisticated than in Roman times.  Get a freeking clue dude.

3. You are 100% incorrect in your statement that the data gathered over the last 100 years (and the past 30+ for high resolution) is estimates.  That is absolutely wrong.  It is directly measured data.

4.  Your blathering about earth and it's age, and man somehow destroying shows how out to lunch you are.  Climate change is not about man destroying the earth, that isn't going to happen.  It is about how much man's impact is absorbed by the planet and how the natural cycles and processes of the planet deal with man's influence.

Neal 
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Re: our wood stoves are horrible but epa thinks this is fine
« Reply #162 on: April 22, 2014, 09:47:59 AM »

Just remember Neal this debate is all in fun no hard feelings!
No problem.  :thumbup:

There is far more money in denying man's influence than admitting it.  Government grants are a drop in the bucket compared to the cost that energy companies are forcing themselves to cover up by denying.  Just look at leaded gasoline as an example.

Neal
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Jwood

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Re: our wood stoves are horrible but epa thinks this is fine
« Reply #163 on: April 22, 2014, 10:17:50 AM »

I'm going to agree with Sloppy on the topic of wasted money on cow fart studies, cows are not being domesticated because they make great pets, its simple supply and demand people want steaks, Hamburgers, milk and cheese!
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Re: our wood stoves are horrible but epa thinks this is fine
« Reply #164 on: April 22, 2014, 10:46:59 AM »

I'm going to agree with Sloppy on the topic of wasted money on cow fart studies, cows are not being domesticated because they make great pets, its simple supply and demand people want steaks, Hamburgers, milk and cheese!
Well of course we domesticate them for those things, that doesn't mean we should ignore the issues that domestication creates.

Neal
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