Outdoor Wood Furnace Info

Outdoor Furnaces - Manufacturers WITH EPA-Certified Models => WoodMaster => Topic started by: tlynholland on November 04, 2010, 08:03:14 PM

Title: WOODMASTER 4400 OVER BOILING & USING WATER
Post by: tlynholland on November 04, 2010, 08:03:14 PM
This is the beginning of my 3rd season with my 4400. Late last winter it began over heating and now this season it is even worse and consistently. It's boiling the water out the top constantly and I have to constantly re-fill it. I do not see water coming out anywhere else. I have my stove set on 160 but it is running over 200 (212) ALL the time.
I replaced the fire rope and checked the flapper above the fan as my dealer suggested. 
I'm not happy at all with the stove and the guys at work that burn Hardy Stainless steel stoves all claim they have never had ANY trouble. My dealer says I have an air leak somewhere but I can't find it.
Anyone else have this trouble?
Title: Re: WOODMASTER 4400 OVER BOILING & USING WATER
Post by: Dirtslinger on November 05, 2010, 07:44:42 AM
Did you check around the opening for the ash auger.
Mine did the same thing but it was the flapper.
Title: Re: WOODMASTER 4400 OVER BOILING & USING WATER
Post by: tlynholland on November 05, 2010, 07:51:44 AM
I have never used my ash auger or had the front plate off. I checked it and did not notice any opening or leaking around it.
I checked the flapper on the fan and it is staying closed

My fan hardly ever kicks on because my stove stays so hot.

Very frustating
Title: Re: WOODMASTER 4400 OVER BOILING & USING WATER
Post by: NewToIt on November 05, 2010, 12:23:06 PM
Sorry about your troubles.... but the only thing I can think of is an air leak.  If the fan is not running, as you've stated, and the stove is burning that hot...... it must be getting too much air when it shouldn't be.

Hope you find the problem.
Title: Re: WOODMASTER 4400 OVER BOILING & USING WATER
Post by: Dirtslinger on November 05, 2010, 02:20:15 PM
I have never used my ash auger or had the front plate off. I checked it and did not notice any opening or leaking around it.
I checked the flapper on the fan and it is staying closed

My fan hardly ever kicks on because my stove stays so hot.

Very frustating

Does the door close hard or easy?
Title: Re: WOODMASTER 4400 OVER BOILING & USING WATER
Post by: tlynholland on November 05, 2010, 04:22:51 PM
The door swings just fine, but I have to push hard to turn the handle and close it.  I don't ever see smoke coming out anywhere except for the flu. Before I replace the fire rope I was seeing smoke come out around my door.
Title: Re: WOODMASTER 4400 OVER BOILING & USING WATER
Post by: Dirtslinger on November 05, 2010, 04:47:30 PM
The door swings just fine, but I have to push hard to turn the handle and close it.  I don't ever see smoke coming out anywhere except for the flu. Before I replace the fire rope I was seeing smoke come out around my door.

I was just out looking at mine. Trying to find out why yours is doing that the only thing that I see would be the door gasket but you said you replaced that.
What about around the rod you pull out before opening the door. How tall of a stack do you have?
Title: Re: WOODMASTER 4400 OVER BOILING & USING WATER
Post by: Sawdust on November 07, 2010, 10:08:38 AM
Sir,  I don't have a lot of experience with my 4400 WM yet, haven't had any problems.  Your furnace has to have access to air inorder to burn out of control. You say there is no leak through the door or auger. I am nort sure about the arrangement of the baffle rod, but it does seem to allow the stove to vent better. I would check into the possibility of  a malunction in that area.  Good Luck
Title: Re: WOODMASTER 4400 OVER BOILING & USING WATER
Post by: willieG on November 07, 2010, 01:42:31 PM
i know nothing of this stove you have but have a question or two. you say you can find no air leaks, well to have your stove boil over your stove is getting air from somewhere. are you standing beside your stove and see and hear the fan shut off and the solenoid close the damper to the air supply at your setting of 160? are you sure your aquastat is functioning properly and shutting off at 160?

when your damper is shut off can you go around it (if it is not windy) with a smoke stick (something like inscense) and see if any of the smoke is being drawin into the stove around the door or air damper areas.

these things are very simple...no air, no fire.

Title: Re: WOODMASTER 4400 OVER BOILING & USING WATER
Post by: Dirtslinger on November 08, 2010, 06:12:56 PM
Did you find the air leak yet?
Title: Re: WOODMASTER 4400 OVER BOILING & USING WATER
Post by: Scott7m on November 10, 2010, 07:35:58 PM
Like everyone has said....   you have an air leak... no if's, and's, or but's abouts it!   

Your going to have to more closely inspect your stove and try what willie said.  It's drawing in air somewhere!

As far as the hardy owners..  I think your stove is better than a hardy, you just have a problem that you haven't pinned down.  It will most likely be Very simple when you find it
Title: Re: WOODMASTER 4400 OVER BOILING & USING WATER - RESOLVED!!! YIPPEE!
Post by: tlynholland on November 16, 2010, 08:01:40 AM
Well, here is what I did to find my leak. I put a bucket on top of the flue and watched for smoke to come out. Turns out my door which I had put new fire rop on was the culprit.  I had bought the largest size rope at Tractor Supply (TSC) which was 5/8s in diameter.  They also included a small tube of high temp gasket seal with it, but it didn't go very far. This time I went to Rural King and found their 3/4 inch rope and bought a large tube of gasket sealant. I toook off the old rope and disc grinded the door area to bare metal. I applied a liberal amount of sealant and then secured the new thicker rope. I left the door open untile the sealant dried before closing it. Now I am operating at 170 to 177 at the highest. I have my stove set to 160 so the fan kicks off when it gets to that temp.
Would I have done any damage to my stove with having it burn so hot and boiling out the water?
It seems to be working fine now. My house is nice and toasty warm and I do not have to constantly fill it up with water.  I'm very happy again.

THANKS for all the advice and suggestions!
Title: Re: WOODMASTER 4400 OVER BOILING & USING WATER
Post by: Dirtslinger on November 16, 2010, 08:09:44 AM
Glad you found the problem. Has far as any damage you should be fine I boiled mine over 3 times before I found my problem and my temp was 212.
Title: Re: WOODMASTER 4400 OVER BOILING & USING WATER
Post by: willieG on November 16, 2010, 04:08:22 PM
bucket on the chimney...good idea i am sure we will all remember that one!

aint it nice when things can be fixed so easily
Title: Re: WOODMASTER 4400 OVER BOILING & USING WATER
Post by: Larson88 on November 16, 2010, 09:31:56 PM
 :thumbup:
Title: Re: WOODMASTER 4400 OVER BOILING & USING WATER - RESOLVED!!! YIPPEE!
Post by: Scott7m on November 25, 2010, 09:29:24 AM
Well, here is what I did to find my leak. I put a bucket on top of the flue and watched for smoke to come out. Turns out my door which I had put new fire rop on was the culprit.  I had bought the largest size rope at Tractor Supply (TSC) which was 5/8s in diameter.  They also included a small tube of high temp gasket seal with it, but it didn't go very far. This time I went to Rural King and found their 3/4 inch rope and bought a large tube of gasket sealant. I toook off the old rope and disc grinded the door area to bare metal. I applied a liberal amount of sealant and then secured the new thicker rope. I left the door open untile the sealant dried before closing it. Now I am operating at 170 to 177 at the highest. I have my stove set to 160 so the fan kicks off when it gets to that temp.
Would I have done any damage to my stove with having it burn so hot and boiling out the water?
It seems to be working fine now. My house is nice and toasty warm and I do not have to constantly fill it up with water.  I'm very happy again.

THANKS for all the advice and suggestions!

i'm lost.. your fan kicks off at 160?  but your now operating at 170-177?   


s
Title: Re: WOODMASTER 4400 OVER BOILING & USING WATER - RESOLVED!!! YIPPEE!
Post by: Dirtslinger on November 25, 2010, 11:38:36 AM
Well, here is what I did to find my leak. I put a bucket on top of the flue and watched for smoke to come out. Turns out my door which I had put new fire rop on was the culprit.  I had bought the largest size rope at Tractor Supply (TSC) which was 5/8s in diameter.  They also included a small tube of high temp gasket seal with it, but it didn't go very far. This time I went to Rural King and found their 3/4 inch rope and bought a large tube of gasket sealant. I toook off the old rope and disc grinded the door area to bare metal. I applied a liberal amount of sealant and then secured the new thicker rope. I left the door open untile the sealant dried before closing it. Now I am operating at 170 to 177 at the highest. I have my stove set to 160 so the fan kicks off when it gets to that temp.
Would I have done any damage to my stove with having it burn so hot and boiling out the water?
It seems to be working fine now. My house is nice and toasty warm and I do not have to constantly fill it up with water.  I'm very happy again.

THANKS for all the advice and suggestions!

i'm lost.. your fan kicks off at 160?  but your now operating at 170-177?   


s
Maybe that is when his fan kicks on.
Title: Re: WOODMASTER 4400 OVER BOILING & USING WATER
Post by: willieG on November 25, 2010, 04:29:05 PM
i can see a 10 or 12 degree rise in the water temp at teh stove after the fan shuts off, IF no hot water is being used to heat anything when the fan shuts off. If you have a good load of wood in th e stove and the fan has been roaring away for some time to get the water up to temp, when it shuts off (the fan)  there will still be a raging fire for a few moments and a very very hot bed of coals until all the air in the stove is used up. If no heat is being drawn from the stove and it is only circulating the water could easily pick up 10 or 12 degrees before the fire is cooled down. that is one reason many OWB owners that use their stoves all summer long actually lower the high temp of their stove, they don't do it just becasue they dont need that high temp for their domestic hot water but it also prevents summer time boil overs from "heat rise" when the fan shuts off.
Title: Re: WOODMASTER 4400 OVER BOILING & USING WATER
Post by: mober on November 25, 2010, 04:44:48 PM
i agree with willie

it happens to me sometime when i use hardwood and get a really nice coal bed and the burn chamber gets really hot and the steel will hold that heat and thats why it can keep raising the water temp even after the fan shuts down.
my burn box is 3/8 inch thick by the way , homemade.
its just great experience to build one yourself and you get to know everything about the stove inside and out strongest point and weakest point.this thing is make me so proud everyday i dont use propane and every single log i feed it i thank god for for blessing me to be able to build it!
jackel take your time with your build it looks great dont rush it.
i enjoyed building mine so much i want to build another one just for the heck of it :bag:
Title: Re: WOODMASTER 4400 OVER BOILING & USING WATER
Post by: Scott7m on November 30, 2010, 07:54:33 PM
i can see that happening willie...  i've just never experienced it with my stove even in warmer weather.    My aquastat has been on 150 since oct 1, and when the fan shuts off a few minutes later it may creep to 153 but no more than that.   
Title: Re: WOODMASTER 4400 OVER BOILING & USING WATER
Post by: willieG on November 30, 2010, 08:38:31 PM
you may not have it happen on yours but it does happen that is why some guys turn their heat down in the summer, to allow for this to happen.
Title: Re: WOODMASTER 4400 OVER BOILING & USING WATER
Post by: tlynholland on December 03, 2010, 07:20:10 PM
I set my stove temp to operate at 160. I think it is set to kick on the fan when it drops 20 degrees below that.  I usually always burn oak, maple, hickory or ash hardwood. My stove fan runs until it hits 160 degrees and then kick off but my temp goes up another 10 degrees or so depending on the weather and the wood and the load I have in it. 

What temp do most of you have your stove set to operate at?  What wood do you burn?  How often do you empty all of your ash?  I do not have an auger other than my arms and a shovel so I empty mine out once or twice a week and then build a new fire.  I have a nice ash pile back behind my stove.
Title: Re: WOODMASTER 4400 OVER BOILING & USING WATER
Post by: willieG on December 03, 2010, 08:17:18 PM
I set my stove temp to operate at 160. I think it is set to kick on the fan when it drops 20 degrees below that.  I usually always burn oak, maple, hickory or ash hardwood. My stove fan runs until it hits 160 degrees and then kick off but my temp goes up another 10 degrees or so depending on the weather and the wood and the load I have in it. 

What temp do most of you have your stove set to operate at?  What wood do you burn?  How often do you empty all of your ash?  I do not have an auger other than my arms and a shovel so I empty mine out once or twice a week and then build a new fire.  I have a nice ash pile back behind my stove.
i run 160 also and my temp creeps up anywhere from 5 to 10 degrees depending on if my system is using hot water or not when the blower shuts off. I too have no augers (or other bells and whistles) on my home made stove, i let the ashes build up  and take out about 1 full wheel barrow every three or 4 weeks. I burn mostly dead elm  and any other kind of dead wood i find on teh forest floor (it is hard on the chains on my saws but i like to think i am helping keep the forest cleaned up)