Outdoor Wood Furnace Info

Outdoor Furnaces - Manufacturers with NON EPA-Certified Models Only => Shaver Furnace => Topic started by: shaver1652008 on December 01, 2013, 08:33:01 PM

Title: I love my shaver 165 and all the holes
Post by: shaver1652008 on December 01, 2013, 08:33:01 PM
Hi, new member here with rust- problems.
 I bought a shaver 165 owb in late 2008 and was delivered in feb 09.
I let it sit for the rest of the winter and installed it in the later months of the year around aug (with no water in it yet). Never had a problem and seemed to keep my poorly insulated house around 72°. This past winter (2012)going into (2013)
I was topping off and all of a sudden I seen a lot of steam coming out the bottom of stove. I quickly ran over and saw the water was pouring out the bottom of the stove. So now im trying to fix and just was curious what others are doing to fix the problem with the bottom of the stove rusting through. I have a sheet of 3\16 steel I can weld on bottom and have a plasma cutter for cutting. I got a very good deal on the steel otherwise I would have gotten 1\4 inch plate
ok so now im asking for you to look at the pictures and help me plan the best way of going about fixing this thank you all and look forward to your suggestions.

[attachment deleted by admin for space issues]
Title: Re: I love my shaver 165 and all the holes
Post by: Wood Nutt on December 01, 2013, 08:49:36 PM
Have you tried contacting Shaver?  The stove should still be under warranty.

If I fixed it, I would cut the bottom off and replace the whole thing.  I don't like the idea of just covering the existing bottom and water setting between the old bottom and new bottom.  be sure to look at the sides if you have the bottom cut off.  Good luck.
Title: Re: I love my shaver 165 and all the holes
Post by: Wood Nutt on December 01, 2013, 09:13:51 PM
Do a search on this blog with the following "How I improved my shaver boiler model 290".  if you tear into yours, this is a good post on some things you can consider doing.

My shaver is starting its 2nd year.  hope I am not looking at the same thing in a few years!
Title: Re: I love my shaver 165 and all the holes
Post by: doow14 on December 02, 2013, 08:39:18 AM
That sucks,thats a lot of holes what did you find in the bottom of the tank?was there a bunch of  slag? someone on here will give you good advise on how to repair it.Good luck
Title: Re: I love my shaver 165 and all the holes
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on December 02, 2013, 09:22:58 AM
Your best bet is to cut the bottom off and get all of the weld slag out, I would bet that is what caused the swiss cheese effect on the bottom. Can't remember if Shaver welds their firebox supports to the bottom or not. Someone will chime in and let you know if they do and how they resupported it. Should be straight forward other than that. Cut it off with the cutter and cut the old legs off then weld it back up.
Title: Re: I love my shaver 165 and all the holes
Post by: jimr on December 02, 2013, 09:25:05 AM
Did it rust from the inside out?
Title: Re: I love my shaver 165 and all the holes
Post by: shaver1652008 on December 03, 2013, 07:13:07 PM
I did contact shaver, they wont cover it. I should have known because the year before I called about a new shaker grate that disingrated , of course  they didnt want to cover that either but would sell me one for 250 or some high price,I forget now. So screw them ill fix and modify it myself.

I plan on cutting bottom off as suggested  and finding whatever slag crap and stuff is in there and clean it out. I'll also look at side towards the bottom  as suggested and fix accordingly (may be asking more questions on this).

pretty sure it did rust from inside but the outside also looks horrible. It has some pitting and looks like if it didn't fail from inside it would have from the outside. They should have them blasted and painted, after all they are supposed to last 20+ years outside in the elements, with no paint it has no chance.
Title: Re: I love my shaver 165 and all the holes
Post by: Wood Nutt on December 04, 2013, 06:30:52 AM
did they give you a reason why it was not a warranty repair? >:(
Title: Re: I love my shaver 165 and all the holes
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on December 04, 2013, 08:56:38 AM
I am going to throw a wild guess out there and say that he didn't have his water chemistry tested every other day.
Title: Re: I love my shaver 165 and all the holes
Post by: jimr on December 04, 2013, 08:57:58 AM
What rust blocker were you using?
Title: Re: I love my shaver 165 and all the holes
Post by: jimr on December 04, 2013, 09:01:37 AM
I am going to throw a wild guess out there and say that he didn't have his water chemistry tested every other day.
Shaver doesn't require any test if you use there product
Title: Re: I love my shaver 165 and all the holes
Post by: Wood Nutt on December 04, 2013, 09:09:38 AM
My Shaver manual says that their corrosion protection product is Treatment Solution 101 from Wood Boiler Solutions LLC.  You would have needed to keep all of your initial tests and order information from Wood Boiler Solutions as they don't keep record of it, that is the stove owner's responsibiliy from what I was told when I put my Shaver into service.
Title: Re: I love my shaver 165 and all the holes
Post by: jimr on December 05, 2013, 04:39:19 AM
When I purchased my unit 3-30-10, I had to buy the rust blocker from Shaver. The cost was $250 and was told it was good for 5 years and no test were needed . By the way it was in a 5gal jug.
Wood Nutt, i did read that in the manual..Ben Shaver told my neighbor and me for the warranty we had to use there rust blocker.
Title: Re: I love my shaver 165 and all the holes
Post by: shaver1652008 on December 09, 2013, 11:16:46 AM
I was using the wood solution 101 for rust treatment,but I lost my first water test results and without that the warranty is void. It is what it is now, so ill deal with it.I do like the design over all the other ones.just needs more water circulation in tank .
heres a pic of the crap I pulled out if it!
Thought you would like to see what was in it when bottom was cut off

[attachment deleted by admin for space issues]
Title: Re: I love my shaver 165 and all the holes
Post by: Wood Nutt on December 09, 2013, 12:06:53 PM
Yuk, and I know that part of the boiler is about impossible to get to easily to try and clean.  if you put in a new bottom, maybe slope it to a drain where it could be flushed periodically, like you would do with a hot water heater???  Just a thought.
Title: Re: I love my shaver 165 and all the holes
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on December 09, 2013, 03:26:38 PM
Holy Hell! Other than rust, what else is in that! A lot of people have/will have to put new bottoms on their shavers. If you could take some pics through out of the process and post them up I know it would help a lot of people out.
Title: Re: I love my shaver 165 and all the holes
Post by: shaver1652008 on December 09, 2013, 08:33:47 PM
Right now for the time being, im just going to put new bottom on and run it. Ill use the rust treatment and this spring ill really give her a good overhaul and do some mods that other's have done.

So more pictures now!
Dont make fun om me lol! It's been awhile since I have cut with a plasma cutter.  This cutter is from Eastwood. It's There top model the "versa cut 60"  plasma cutter.
It worked perfectly and have no issues other than my ability to cut a straight line!
These pics are just to get bottom off ill go back and make everything straight and good looking. 

[attachment deleted by admin for space issues]
Title: Re: I love my shaver 165 and all the holes
Post by: shaver1652008 on December 09, 2013, 08:44:51 PM
Ok another post because I just figured out how to post multiple pic's!
In the top pic you can see the inlet/outlet pipe is NOT lined up with the cut out for circulation to front of the stove, the other side looks lined up ok but ill extend and mark it so I know its the long one to front of stove

[attachment deleted by admin for space issues]
Title: Re: I love my shaver 165 and all the holes
Post by: jimr on December 12, 2013, 01:43:44 PM
Was this unit sitting on a concrete pad? The bottom metal looks awful rusty. The square tubing is even rusted.
How much of the crap you got out of the bottom is welding slag from weld rite mfg.?
Title: Re: I love my shaver 165 and all the holes
Post by: lugnut on December 12, 2013, 01:50:23 PM
When I purchased my unit 3-30-10, I had to buy the rust blocker from Shaver. The cost was $250 and was told it was good for 5 years and no test were needed . By the way it was in a 5gal jug.
Wood Nutt, i did read that in the manual..Ben Shaver told my neighbor and me for the warranty we had to use there rust blocker.

Jimr is correct.  When using the product that Shaver supplies....we do NOT have to have the water tested.  The only thing required by them is that every five years the old gets drained and new treatment put in.

My FIRST Shaver 165 was JUNK and I told them so...we had a bit of a go around, but I won...and also decided to upgrade as the dealer rep here wasn't of much help and I learned a lot by calling Shaver up and talking to a fellow who no longer works at Shaver...his name was RAY.  He KNEW all there was to know about the product and he held nothing back.  I basically informed them that I was going to give them the benefit of doubt and that they build me a unit that their wives could put in their dining room and store their fine china in....or else I was going to be taking someone to court.  I received my 250 Pro 6 months later and to this day...KNOCK ON WOOD...I've not had any issues and I can tell you the difference between the 250 PRO and the first 165 I got is like night and day.

I don't come on this site very much....just here now because a friend of mine was having issues with his Shaver and told me about the fellow over her that was having issues with his 165.

What ever you end up doing in repairing your unit...get that rust blocker from Shaver...no testing is involved.  good luck with the repairs...and remember, no matter what anyone says on here regarding Shaver products and believe me there ARE a lot of naysayers....all these wood furnaces have one thing in common...heat the water.  Some may be built like tanks and some many pay for name only...I can think of one right off the top of my head, but I'm NOT here to bash manufactures.  Make your repairs and make it right for you.  Wanna get a hold of me, look for me on the other site.

Lugnut
aka: Jerry
Title: Re: I love my shaver 165 and all the holes
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on December 12, 2013, 01:59:40 PM
Thanks for the pics. Im sure it will help some others out with how to fix theirs.
Title: Re: I love my shaver 165 and all the holes
Post by: shaver1652008 on December 12, 2013, 08:15:56 PM
Was this unit sitting on a concrete pad? The bottom metal looks awful rusty. The square tubing is even rusted.
How much of the crap you got out of the bottom is welding slag from weld rite mfg.?

Yes this was on a concrete pad, every part of it is rusty except some of the painted parts on the backs door area and hinges.
From what I can see in the crap I scraped out it was probably about 1/4 slag and the rest was just thick pieces of rust from the bottom steel plate were there was no circulation of water
ill post another pic up of just the bottom (out inside) were it sat on the pad
this is why they need to paint this stuff and not leave bare metal, I mean come on they are outside in the weather!

[attachment deleted by admin for space issues]
Title: Re: I love my shaver 165 and all the holes
Post by: doow14 on December 13, 2013, 03:14:54 AM
from what I can see looks like the side walls on your water jacket are fairly clean? mine are a little on the scaly side.I don't even want to know what the bottom looks like.One things for sure with their design the drain is about 3/4 up from the bottom that will never let it drain fully and flush out the goo.sorry for your troubles,thanks for the postings,I'm sure I'm goin to be dealing with the same sh$t sooner or later.Good luck
Title: Re: I love my shaver 165 and all the holes
Post by: shaver1652008 on December 13, 2013, 08:53:31 PM
from what I can see looks like the side walls on your water jacket are fairly clean? mine are a little on the scaly side.I don't even want to know what the bottom looks like.One things for sure with their design the drain is about 3/4 up from the bottom that will never let it drain fully and flush out the goo.
Yes side walls at the bottom edges looked ok after I cleaned them up.
Next time I have it off the pad im going to add a drain valve on the bottom so I can drain and flush properly, but for now its 10° here in michigan and I need it so im just fixing the bottom for now
Title: Re: I love my shaver 165 and all the holes
Post by: jimr on December 23, 2013, 01:46:11 PM
Interesting, on page 6 of this form another fella posted a bottom rust failure very similar as this one, and what I figure the units were both mfg. in 2009.
Title: Re: I love my shaver 165 and all the holes
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on December 23, 2013, 02:42:03 PM
I think they probably use the cheapest deal that they can get regardless of steel quality. I know at one point they were using pipe line remnants for the fire boxes.
Title: Re: I love my shaver 165 and all the holes
Post by: willieG on December 23, 2013, 04:11:14 PM
I think they probably use the cheapest deal that they can get regardless of steel quality. I know at one point they were using pipe line remnants for the fire boxes.
most pipeline pipe is actually much better quality steel than the cheaper grades of rolled plate
Title: Re: I love my shaver 165 and all the holes
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on December 23, 2013, 04:54:41 PM
That might absolutely be the case but wasn't really my point. My point was that they use what they can get a deal on.
Title: Re: I love my shaver 165 and all the holes
Post by: willieG on December 23, 2013, 05:06:43 PM
im not saying if it is right or not..i work for a steel fabricating company and we are always looking for "good deals" we by drop offs from the steel companies at cheaper rates when they are available these are still brand new bemas but they have been cut from a 60 foot length and they may not be exactly 20, 40, or 60 feet. if a customer before us orders their steel cut to length and lets say there is a piece 34 foot 6 inches they may elect to sell it a little cheaper as it is not a standard length and they allready made money becasue they charge for the cut they did for the previous customer. if they were buying pipe that was new but was a drop off from the pipe line company i would see nothing wrong with that (if it was new)
Title: Re: I love my shaver 165 and all the holes
Post by: jimr on December 24, 2013, 03:36:31 PM
from what I see it's not the pipe that's the problem it's the flat plate on the bottom.Merry Christmas
Title: Re: I love my shaver 165 and all the holes
Post by: willieG on December 24, 2013, 04:09:29 PM
from what I see it's not the pipe that's the problem it's the flat plate on the bottom.Merry Christmas
if you are willing to pay you can buy high grade plate....if you drive down the highways and look at the overpasses as you go under them you will see very few are painted, they are made from a high grade steel that will rust on the surface and not go any deeper (or at least will not deteriate at a very fast pace)  if you were to wire brush this surface rust off to bare metal it will rust again. i am not a metalurgist (if that is even the right spelling) but  i have installed these bridges here in canada and they must be welded with a much different rod than normal mild steel and preheating to drive the moisture from the steel is a must. i am sure this would be a good material to use for a stove but the cost would not likley be affordable to most of us.
Title: Re: I love my shaver 165 and all the holes
Post by: Jason37756 on February 25, 2017, 07:31:28 PM
Well...it has come time to replace the bottom of my shaver!!!

All of the pictures have been removed, so if anybody has them I would appreciate seeing them.

Thanks
Title: Re: I love my shaver 165 and all the holes
Post by: mlappin on February 25, 2017, 08:14:27 PM
Well...it has come time to replace the bottom of my shaver!!!

All of the pictures have been removed, so if anybody has them I would appreciate seeing them.

Thanks

Unless the owner of the original pictures reposts them they are gone.  :-\ Just like the message says, they were deleted for space when they didn’t have any room left