Outdoor Wood Furnace Info

All-Purpose OWF Discussions => General Outdoor Furnace Discussion => Topic started by: coolidge on October 01, 2017, 06:40:27 PM

Title: Almost
Post by: coolidge on October 01, 2017, 06:40:27 PM
That time of year. Think I am going to fire up next weekend.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: mlappin on October 01, 2017, 09:24:40 PM
Yep, getting close, was 41 degrees yesterday morning here.

I have all my new double wall stainless stack for the shop, just waiting on a T to show up.

Get it up, then I’ll just batch burn the waste oil boiler till it gets actually cold here.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on October 08, 2017, 02:32:34 PM
Looks like I will be firing up tomorrow, weatherman says highs in the low 60 after tomorrow.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: MattyNH on October 08, 2017, 06:48:32 PM
Looks like I will be firing up tomorrow, weatherman says highs in the low 60 after tomorrow.
  Wow really?? You may wanna check your weather temps again.. We get the same whether.. 71F M , 78F t, 60's t-friday, 76F sat
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: E Yoder on October 09, 2017, 01:11:10 AM
Yeah, it's really damp and warm here in VA, from Nate I guess. I'm ready for snow :)
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on October 09, 2017, 03:42:13 AM
Looks like they did change it a little, tues, Wednesday, Thursday in the 60s now.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: Roger2561 on October 09, 2017, 03:44:51 AM
I usually fire mine up the 2nd or 3rd week of October when the daytime temps seldom get above 50.  But with the forecast showing temps sticking around the 70's this week, I think I'll wait a while.  Roger
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: bowood on October 09, 2017, 07:24:41 AM
Lucky it is still warm in here in NY.  Municipality passed a law saying I cannot fire up until October 31st.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on October 09, 2017, 07:47:38 AM
Wtf!!!!!! Can you post a link to the RSA?
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: bowood on October 09, 2017, 08:10:25 AM
My Town's regulations: http://philipstown.com/bd%20furnace.pdf
Code 172.6.D: "Months of operation. Wood-fired furnaces shall be operated only between November 1 and April 15."
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: mlappin on October 09, 2017, 09:59:31 AM
They really need to do some thing about those antiquated minimum stack heights given how cool the stack temps already are on any of the new gasifiers.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: whitepine2 on October 09, 2017, 10:09:50 AM
What a bunch of B S this is just another money grab by city or town.Look like they are trying to stop folks from installing boilers plane and simple. More SNOWFLAKE rules or should I say FLAKE rule.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: mlappin on October 09, 2017, 10:36:42 AM
What a bunch of B S this is just another money grab by city or town.Look like they are trying to stop folks from installing boilers plane and simple. More SNOWFLAKE rules or should I say FLAKE rule.
My Town's regulations: http://philipstown.com/bd%20furnace.pdf
Code 172.6.D: "Months of operation. Wood-fired furnaces shall be operated only between November 1 and April 15."

On the flip side, at least they allow the use of OWB’s in city limits.

The town board members in my town all got new inserts or whatever they wanted, then passed an ordinance against any new wood burners of any kind in town limits.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: Roger2561 on October 09, 2017, 10:43:25 AM
I guess the only way to beat that is to vote the SOB's out of office and then change it. 
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: bowood on October 09, 2017, 10:45:07 AM
I got the permit and complied.  Not too big a deal, but glad it hasn't gotten cold yet.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on October 09, 2017, 10:54:44 AM
Seeing as how New York and arguably the country requires Phase 2 outdoor wood boilers, you should petition the town to have this ordinance amended to be current with gassification boilers. I assume this is a 20 year old ordinance when conventionals were smoking people out.  Now that there is no smoke they should really amend both the distance and the time frame for using.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: bowood on October 09, 2017, 01:58:07 PM
The time frame is a new addition added in 2015: http://philipstown.com/tba72915.pdf
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: MattyNH on October 09, 2017, 02:36:48 PM
Seeing as how New York and arguably the country requires Phase 2 outdoor wood boilers, you should petition the town to have this ordinance amended to be current with gassification boilers. I assume this is a 20 year old ordinance when conventionals were smoking people out.  Now that there is no smoke they should really amend both the distance and the time frame for using.
:post: And should reduce amount of acreage to have one..OWB really have cleaned up..They should take another look at them..
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on October 09, 2017, 03:49:22 PM
New addition brought on by what problem? In 2015 only gassers in ny state should be operating which have no smoke or smell.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: bowood on October 09, 2017, 04:21:14 PM
As far as I can tell someone asked at a board meeting.  Presumably heard about similar ordinance elsewhere.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on October 09, 2017, 04:38:35 PM
So would previous installs be grandfathered from this new rule?
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: bowood on October 09, 2017, 04:58:36 PM
I think setbacks and such are grandfathered, but that the months allowed for burning are not grandfathered.  Worried your town will pass such a thing?
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on October 09, 2017, 06:04:43 PM
No, I just think it is complete bs. How can you change the rules after the fact?
How can you do that with no public
Session to allow for arguments from the permit holders. And furthermore for what reason would they limit when you can use it?!?!?
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: fireboss on October 09, 2017, 06:33:02 PM
I hope that never happens here, I run mine all year , I heat my pool and hot water all summer but I am smart about it , I don't smoke the neighborhood out .I keep it burning  real hot by not over loading it  and I use mostly pine so most of it gets used up so when it's idling it doesn't stink up the neighborhood
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: mlappin on October 09, 2017, 07:16:23 PM
You can go and argue with a town board all you want, most won’t listen and the few that aren’t complete idiots will know you’re gonna have smoke when first starting it or loading it, this would hold true for any brand gasifier and that’s all the reason they need.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on October 10, 2017, 03:25:00 AM
There is nothing written at the "State" level that would over rule local law about heating your house?
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: Bluegrass Wood Burner on October 23, 2017, 04:58:09 PM
Fire ole "Buford the Dragon" up today. I named it that after it almost got me couple times when the flame puff 😄 took about 2 hours to bring it up to 180. Just old junk rotten wood I had picked out to start with. So now it's twice a day for next 6 months.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: mlappin on October 23, 2017, 06:30:08 PM
May be firing earlier than I wanted, supposed to be down to freezing a couple of times in the next week. I may change my plans for tomorrow and get the site glass installed in the G200 then fire it up. Will run it while converting a fuel oil burner to waste oil then mounting that in the shop boiler in place of the current totally manual one that I’ve been using for a long time.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: Bluegrass Wood Burner on October 23, 2017, 06:56:07 PM
I had planned on starting mine around 1st weekend of November. However here in Ky we are having 2-3 nights in a row in low 30s. Just hate to hear that heat pump kicking on. I've got 25-30 cords of wood cut and stacked. So it wasn't a hard choice for me.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: E Yoder on October 24, 2017, 11:48:27 AM
Fire ole "Buford the Dragon" up today. I named it that after it almost got me couple times when the flame puff 😄 took about 2 hours to bring it up to 180. Just old junk rotten wood I had picked out to start with. So now it's twice a day for next 6 months.
Buford... I like that.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: wreckit87 on October 24, 2017, 02:24:30 PM
Was thinking maybe the end of next week, if the weather wanted me to because I need to do a little repiping first and add a pump for the shop.. But I'm starting to think it's going to happen in the next day or two if I can find that darn NRF-25 I've been tripping over for 3 years. Now that I wanna use it, it's nowhere to be found
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: mlappin on October 24, 2017, 05:19:47 PM
Was thinking maybe the end of next week, if the weather wanted me to because I need to do a little repiping first and add a pump for the shop.. But I'm starting to think it's going to happen in the next day or two if I can find that darn NRF-25 I've been tripping over for 3 years. Now that I wanna use it, it's nowhere to be found

Yep, I had an old fuel oil burner around that came out of our basement, saved it for something else i the future, now that the future is here and I need it can’t be found anywhere. Looked in all the barns, sheds, etc. Had to buy one of Ebay to convert into a waste oil burner, of course that one came with a L1 or V1 retention head, had to throw that away and start over. I expect to trip over the one I was saving about tomorrow morning.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on October 27, 2017, 07:30:48 AM
Coolidge, how is that slab heating now?
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on October 27, 2017, 07:42:18 PM
Ahhhh not really shure, been working too much to pay attention. Warm in the shop though, or was the last time I was in there.

Temps have been crazy warm for this time of year.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on October 27, 2017, 07:54:56 PM
But your wood consumption I assume isn't out of control like it was.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on October 28, 2017, 05:57:52 AM
Been through just over half a cord since October 12th just heating shop, the house for a few mornings and NO domestic hot water( need too clean the tubes)

Boiler has been down for about a week of that time also.

So no I don't think my issue is fixed, guess I better stack some wood this weekend.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on October 28, 2017, 07:29:13 AM
Hmm. Well looks like you need to put a data logging system on like rsi has or controlbyweb to graph where all your btus are going.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: silver star on October 28, 2017, 07:30:04 AM
Thusrday was beuatiful, so i went home a little early to move some wood around. Smelled kreosote and saw smok coming out of my neighbor OWB, fisrt fire-up for the year.

I am heading out this morning to get mine going. Just had a heater installed in the arravhed garage, to create an insulating affect for the bonus room above and that interior walls adjacent to the garage.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on October 28, 2017, 08:01:17 AM
Would like something like that only wireless.  RSI you building any? i know we talked about it last year.
I hate the thought of digging up that Logstor just too look.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on October 28, 2017, 08:27:49 AM
I don't think logstor has anything wrong with it but who knows I guess, there is always a first time. I good temp reading leaving the boiler and leaving the logstor run should handle that. Control by web just came out with this. I think it would work for you, it is wireless. https://www.controlbyweb.com/webrelay-wireless/
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on October 28, 2017, 09:50:19 AM
Looks cool,   Only problem is buying all the accessories and hooking it all up.

Computer crap is not my thing, maybe the kids could do it for me?
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on October 28, 2017, 09:59:40 AM
I haven't dealt with them but they look simple. In sure as long as your kids are somewhat computer literate then it would be no problem. I think it is as simple as getting a thermocouple to place where ever you want to put it and plugging it in. It acts like a wifi printer per say I think, it is it's own standalone wifi point which you can address off of your web browser using it's IP address. 
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on October 28, 2017, 12:12:18 PM
I ordered one with 4 temp sensors, will report after I get it hooked up.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on October 28, 2017, 08:13:35 PM
Cool!
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 05, 2017, 01:12:36 PM
Did you get the controlbyweb yet???
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 05, 2017, 01:52:42 PM
Not yet, should be in tomorrow.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 05, 2017, 04:40:12 PM
I can't wait. I've been waiting to pull the trigger myself. Which model did you get? The wifi stand alone model?
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 05, 2017, 06:23:01 PM
Yes,  it will be interesting to see where all those btus are going, I used up over a full firebox of wood just today.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 05, 2017, 06:24:04 PM
Wtf. I used 5 small splits today.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: mlappin on November 06, 2017, 07:28:05 PM
Yes,  it will be interesting to see where all those btus are going, I used up over a full firebox of wood just today.

Just a few thoughts here, if you remember exactly where the Logstor runs maybe take an IR gun and walk the ground and look for a warm spot? Only failure of Logstor I can recall is the one Slim told us about when a laborer drove a piece of rebar thru it. So not really a Logstor failure on part of the Logstor.

Something else I thought of, isnt yours the install where the shop run goes under the road to the other side?

Several times this summer either the state or county has been doing road borings, then they come back and do the shoulders…..

If they would actually stop and ask we could tell them where not to bore as we know where all our drainage tiles might go under the road, instead now we can wait for the suck holes to show up then raise hell for a few years until they finally fix em.

Just a wild hair but has maybe your county done borings lately? I’m not sure why our county would be doing them as they don’t spend any money on the back roads unless a town or city councilman lives on it. Not really sure why the state is either, not like they are gonna tear the entire road bed out and start over, especially since some of it still has logs in it from when it was a corduroy road. The guys that tried to bore under it to install stop light sensors found that out as well as the utility company when they ran nat gas to the farm.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: wreckit87 on November 06, 2017, 09:25:38 PM
I've been preaching for years that I run Rehau. I was recently informed that Logstor is actually my bich, despite my idiocy. My 32mm Logstor only loses 1 degree in the 170 feet to the house, but I will admit that it does melt the light snow between A and B. I feel stupid as the day is long, but this isn't what I anticipated. I made a poor mistake boys, and I'm sorry. Still next to no heat loss, but it does thaw the dirt. Not cool IMO and I guarantee the backfill was taken great care of. I've been condoning false information boys, and I apologize
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 06, 2017, 09:31:06 PM
Say whaaaat?
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: mlappin on November 06, 2017, 09:54:52 PM
I've been preaching for years that I run Rehau. I was recently informed that Logstor is actually my bich, despite my idiocy. My 32mm Logstor only loses 1 degree in the 170 feet to the house, but I will admit that it does melt the light snow between A and B. I feel stupid as the day is long, but this isn't what I anticipated. I made a poor mistake boys, and I'm sorry. Still next to no heat loss, but it does thaw the dirt. Not cool IMO and I guarantee the backfill was taken great care of. I've been condoning false information boys, and I apologize

Thats weird, when I installed mine hit an old tile, then the water hit the clay and the whole thing turned to soup. I’ve repaired enough tile over the years to know you can’t patch it and expect it to stay when its floating in water/soup/slop so left the corner open till it dried out. Had ice and snow on that exposed section of Logstor and wouldn’t melt off till the sun got it.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 07, 2017, 03:21:52 AM
I have done the IR gun thing one hundred times. My house loop goes under the road, 100 ft run, 5 to 6 ft deep the entire run. When I crossed the road I ran the logstor through a plastic culvert just for the added protection in this area.

Town does no boring around these parts.
My garage loop actually runs 35 ft on top of the ground.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: E Yoder on November 07, 2017, 03:29:12 AM
I've been preaching for years that I run Rehau. I was recently informed that Logstor is actually my bich, despite my idiocy. My 32mm Logstor only loses 1 degree in the 170 feet to the house, but I will admit that it does melt the light snow between A and B. I feel stupid as the day is long, but this isn't what I anticipated. I made a poor mistake boys, and I'm sorry. Still next to no heat loss, but it does thaw the dirt. Not cool IMO and I guarantee the backfill was taken great care of. I've been condoning false information boys, and I apologize
Trying to follow what you're saying there..
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: slimjim on November 07, 2017, 05:03:42 AM
Well I think what he is saying is that nothing is perfect, there will be some heat loss with any pipe, if the pipe is buried at a shallow depth as many of us do and the ground temperature is 31 degrees F then absolutely I would expect to see some thawing of the snow above the pipe but if anyone can show me a product that delivers better than Logstor does on its promises then  I would be happy to assist them in running some tests.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: mlappin on November 07, 2017, 06:03:13 AM
I have done the IR gun thing one hundred times. My house loop goes under the road, 100 ft run, 5 to 6 ft deep the entire run. When I crossed the road I ran the logstor through a plastic culvert just for the added protection in this area.

Town does no boring around these parts.
My garage loop actually runs 35 ft on top of the ground.

Bummer, was just a thought that would explain a lot though. Wouldn’t have had to be a full hit even, scuff the side of the pipe and open it up and take a little foam with it as well.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: wreckit87 on November 07, 2017, 06:04:51 AM
I had consumed a few beers before that lol sorry. On one of the other pages I've been bragging about my Rehau forever and how awesome it is. The other day I had a chance while playing with new Rehau to realize it had a bigger OD than mine does, so further investigation told me it's actually Logstor that I have buried. Then yesterday when I got home I noticed the thawed path across the yard and started pounding beers while running a pile of tests to see what the issue was. 4 hours later I had a bad case of the dumb and thought it'd be a good idea to get on the computer and speak cursive. Yes Slim it is shallow, 18" or so. But again as Marty mentioned, there's plenty of it out there above grade that snow just sits on bare. I was having an intoxicated vent session, sorry  :-X
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: slimjim on November 07, 2017, 06:17:02 AM
Haaaaah haaaaaah ha, I thought I was the only one who did that sort of thing!  Yes if the ambient temp is close then you will see some snow melt.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 07, 2017, 05:09:14 PM
well had the thingy going this afternoon, clicked out of the page to get other sh!t done and now i can't get back on. "server is not responding"
Go figure, was kinda neat while it was working.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 07, 2017, 05:57:36 PM
Crap. I can't wait to hear how you like it.  Which model did you get.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 07, 2017, 06:29:56 PM
I got this on with the 4 temperature inputs.https://www.controlbyweb.com/webrelay-wireless/
It says a range of 250 feet, but I need to be right next too it to get any signal.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 08, 2017, 04:55:02 AM
So i managed to find my sons wireless extender this morning, this is what i have right now. I did set up a "logging event" that is supposed to email to me, not shire if i did it right but will see.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: slimjim on November 08, 2017, 05:00:11 AM
I gather that there is no call for heat on either loop?
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 08, 2017, 05:06:06 AM
Cool, can you access the info from outside your local network? Can it do a graphing history?
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 08, 2017, 05:29:53 AM
No call on either loop right now.

Baby steps Honda, I am lucky I got that far.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: mlappin on November 08, 2017, 05:31:13 AM
What were the tolerances on the sensors supposed to be?
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 08, 2017, 01:00:35 PM
+/-  .5 c is what the specs say.

Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 09, 2017, 06:03:06 PM
Well I thought I had the dam thing set up, but at 80 ft away I still cannot connect to that things wireless.
I guess it goes in the scrap corner.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 09, 2017, 07:18:53 PM
Hmm. Want to sell it for a good price? ;D
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 09, 2017, 07:35:18 PM
Gotta call the geek squad to set me up something so I can talk with Captain Kirk.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 09, 2017, 07:52:45 PM
Lol. Yeah I ran an Ethernet cable to mine if I ever get one set up so I can do a wired set up.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 10, 2017, 01:12:02 PM
I managed to get a couple readings today, had to be right next to boiler, in truck off course, it's pretty chilly out.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: slimjim on November 10, 2017, 02:31:34 PM
Wow, it doesn't look like you are drawing much of a load on either loop, is there any way you can record a history?
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: mlappin on November 10, 2017, 02:38:20 PM
If you can’t record a history, you could simulate a high load on both. Open the doors and windows and turn the heat on. The first one you posted was idling correct? Temps were very close together so I’d think that'd rule out underground pipe issues.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 10, 2017, 03:04:15 PM
So the problem is that your house wifi doesn't reach the controlbywebrelay signal correct? Could you place a wifi signal booster with the control by web or don't they have some sort of wifi module that can plug into your 120 volt house receptacle and distribute wifi that way?
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 10, 2017, 03:05:33 PM
Was both the house and shop calling for heat at those times? Yes can you do a history with the numbers so you can see when the shop turns on and off.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 10, 2017, 05:02:03 PM
Both those picture it was running wide open and did so for another hour, then shut down for an hour and water temp dropped to 160 in that hour.  This is the latest with no load at either place.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 10, 2017, 05:20:43 PM
Your water temp dropped in the boiler from 180-160 in one hour with nothing calling? My g200 will go for 6 plus hours with no call for heat fro, the house.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 10, 2017, 05:34:08 PM
I used up two full boxes since 7 am today, I got 9 days out of a half cord. At this rate I am switching to oil soon, very soon.

Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 10, 2017, 06:13:56 PM
What's the deal with your shop loop? Can you shut it down the floor so the water just makes a loop back to the boiler?
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 10, 2017, 06:24:22 PM
Yes, it happened to be shut down for a few days last week, batteries died in stat. I was really excited I was only using 5 to 6 splits for overnight just for house, then I went in shop, was cold. I am going to shut it of again tomorrow and see what happens again.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 10, 2017, 06:25:01 PM
Maybe the 200 is just to small.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: mlappin on November 10, 2017, 06:45:47 PM
With no call for heat, why the 6 degree drop in the house loop?

i could be wrong here, but the efficiency ratings are pretty much the same across all models, if you were stuffing it clear full every 8 hours then yes, it’s too small, or if your stuffing it clear full and it can’t keep up, then it’s too small.

I’m just using Miljoco mechanical gauges on the back of mine, used a T and they are directly in the water flow, no thermowells, within whatever accuracy they claim to me with no calls for heat at most there is a degree difference between return and supply. They are reasonably accurate though as the ones on the supply will read almost identical. There a lot better than the freakin Honeywells I have in the basement, according to them I’m so adept at designing  a system my water leaves the house hotter than it came in….

6 degrees may not seem like much, but that’s 6 degrees every minute of every hour of every day, it adds up to a LOT of BTU’s depending on your flow.

Mot likely your using a plate in the house, bypass that, then make sure whatever you have for heat in the house, radiant, forced air, baseboards or whatever is as off as it can be then see if you still have 6 degrees.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: mlappin on November 10, 2017, 06:52:49 PM
Then again I may be full of crap, I looked at your picture again, your shop supply is supposedly 2.6 degrees warmer than your house supply.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 10, 2017, 07:00:27 PM
I have no plates at either house or garage, straight from boiler
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 10, 2017, 07:27:16 PM
Btus are btus. They go somewhere. So you are either using them in the garage because of heat loss(I doubt that this time of year) or losing them to the ground from the pipes or radiant floor. So you use a few splits to heat only the house. Now the radiant floor went cold, we all know it takes a few days of heavy btu input to get it up to temp and then it should sip on the btus. I assume your floor has come up to temp st this point and should be using very little btus at this point. I think without you being able to write a program to record the historical temps from the controlbyweb to figure out how often the floor takes an input for heat then you are going to have to pump water to the shop but bypass the fradisnt floor so it just heads back to the boiler. Run it like that for a couple days to confirm whether or not it is your underground pipes or your floor eating the btus.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 10, 2017, 07:43:52 PM
My SIL is going to come down tomorrow and look over the Controlyweb thingy to see if she can get it to email me whatever it does send.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 10, 2017, 08:50:21 PM
I quickly looked st the owners manual. It looks like you can set it up to report whatever you want but you have to write the code. It tells you how to write the code but I wonder if you can call controlbyweb and ask them for a prewritten one for you.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 11, 2017, 06:13:42 AM
i did a little experiment last night and put the shop T stat on the floor, it was about 4 feet from the floor. seemed to work good, had for the most part a half a box of wood left this morning.
Maybe a slab sensor would have been better.
First one is after i moved T stat too floor.
Other are this morning.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 11, 2017, 07:11:33 AM
Well it was damn cold last night and you only went through a half a firebox rather than a full one by just placing the stat at the floor? That doesn't seem to make any sense to me. With the stat near the floor it's going to read a warmer temp because the floor is 80 degrees but the shop should be whatever you set the t stat at 4 feet off the floor. If the stat was overshooting the slab just wouldn't run for a long time. It is my understanding that a floor sensor is helpful when you have an alternative heat source in the room like a modine or a wood stove. This would keep the floor from overshooting in the case of another heat source adding heat to the space.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 11, 2017, 07:28:36 AM
There is no dude pulling his hair out up top there.  Floor reading was 77 with IR gun last night, calling for heat, T stat at 4 ft high was at 63, so some ceiling fans maybe?
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 11, 2017, 07:51:54 AM
Well radiant is typically good keeping the heat low to the ground where you want it instead of forced hot air where it all flys to the ceiling and you need to push it back down with a ceiling fan. So we are all on the same page what size building is this, what type of construction, how is it insulated?
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 11, 2017, 07:56:56 AM
I just found an old pic of your pour over. Walls look spray foam, what's the ceiling insulated with? How warm is it up at the ceiling?
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 11, 2017, 09:00:07 AM
Ceiling has R 40 foam,   Floor temp 66, peak of roof temp 62
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 11, 2017, 10:33:11 AM
Web thingy is just not going to work for me I guess, can't stay connected to it for more than a few minutes.
Range extender freezes the whole works also.

Have to find something else.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 11, 2017, 10:53:24 AM
I would try giving the company a call and ask them about your issues.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 12, 2017, 06:18:40 AM
left my shop T stat on the floor last night again, seems to be working better, only used half a box in 12 hours. will order some better T stats if they are out there, some reason i don't trust the Walmart specials.

I am also going to add my Modine back into the shop so when i open the door it doesn't take two days to come back up to temp.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 12, 2017, 07:17:15 AM
Hmm this still makes no sense to me. If your floor was using another half a box full of wood then it had to put the btus somewhere. So the shop should be way to hot. Strange that it takes so long for your shop to come back up to temp after opening and closing the door. Everyone with a radiant shop floor says this is where radiant shines, the warm slab brings the room right back up to temp.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: mlappin on November 12, 2017, 10:11:57 PM
Weird, just doesn’t seem to make much sense. BTU’s are going somewhere. My buddy built a new shop, keeps it at 75 at all times, I hate it, too freaking warm, that and I think his slab temp is way to high. Within ten minutes in there for a birthday party I found a chunk of scrap plywood to set on the floor for my feet, felt like somebody dumped a quart of warm water down each shoe, my feet don’t get cold anyways but that was ridiculous.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 13, 2017, 03:52:49 AM
I am going to try a new T stat, maybe move it too a different location,
My trusses are open right now, with R40 foam in the roof, might check with my drywalled and see if he can drywall the ceiling anyway.
sh?t i might even have a blower door test done on the place.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 13, 2017, 04:22:02 AM
Yes, if the boiler burns another 1/2 box of wood then it had to take the btus and send them somewhere. If you moved the thermostat near the floor it would just keep The building cooler since it is closer to the 80 degree floor. This is a shop, how's your garage doors air sealed? They can be a big air leaker.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 13, 2017, 04:35:23 AM
Ok, this is messed up,  while pulling out what's left of my hair last night screwing with controlyweb thing I was thinking of what the guy who did piping whenever I moved the 250 down there.

I believe he told me " you want to pull the water" through the system.
I can't confirm that yet, getting 4 yr old ready for school.. :bash:
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 13, 2017, 06:01:17 AM
Pulling or pushing water doesn't matter as far as losing btus somewhere.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: mlappin on November 13, 2017, 06:06:28 AM
I am going to try a new T stat, maybe move it too a different location,
My trusses are open right now, with R40 foam in the roof, might check with my drywalled and see if he can drywall the ceiling anyway.
sh?t i might even have a blower door test done on the place.

Have you thought about ceilings fans at all? I can’t hardly believe if the slab is 80 something and 4 four foot off the floor its that much cooler. I just have insulation on the roof of the shop as well. 12 1/2 foot tall door then the rafters start. I installed ceilings fans awhile back and used a Goldmine controller to run them, have a sensor up there about a foot lower than the peak, when running the peak temp is about the same as what the T stats are set at, without them it could be 20-30 degrees warmer at the peak.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 15, 2017, 03:30:36 AM
Well guys, it seems my experimental T stat placement is working, I did pick up another to try.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 15, 2017, 05:10:38 AM
Good news! I just can't wrap my head around where the other half of a firebox full of wood went in the building.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 15, 2017, 05:21:05 PM
You could definitely tell it was warmer than 66 in there, fog up your contacts on a few mornings.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: mlappin on November 16, 2017, 06:34:42 AM
So basically your saying the old thermostat was reading colder than it actually was and ran the heat more than needed?
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 16, 2017, 07:35:07 AM
Well hmm, I guess I thought you would have mentioned that it was awful hot In the garage.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 16, 2017, 03:43:38 PM
I never really checked with another thermometer, always went by the thermostat, but a few readings of the floor ( 74)with the thermostat up 4 ft wouldn't really notice the difference unless barefoot. But 8 degrees is a lot.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 16, 2017, 04:25:56 PM
So it has actually been 75 degrees in the building??? How could you do any work in there? I sweat working at 60 degrees.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: mlappin on November 16, 2017, 04:37:36 PM
Not me, I hate working inside anyways, if I’m gonna spend the whole day in the shop I work in a short sleeve t shirt and sneakers, therefore its set at 70.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 16, 2017, 04:54:45 PM
No the floor was at 74, thermostat said 66, actual temp I do not know, but will get a regular thermometer to test.

No way in hell would I work in that heat either.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 16, 2017, 05:26:44 PM
Yeah, so if the room is at a workable temp than I don’t see where the btus are. Can you place a thermometer at the peak of the building?
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 16, 2017, 06:26:13 PM
I hooked up a regular mechanical, turn the dial yesterday, I put the digital right next to it when I got home tonight, just checked it.  Mechanical set at 68, not calling for heat.  Digital was at 64
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 16, 2017, 08:04:28 PM
So atleast 4 degrees off at the floor. I wonder what temp the peak is at.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 17, 2017, 04:53:20 AM
Hoping the t stat thing works, I got 6 days out of half a cord. 
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: mlappin on November 17, 2017, 05:55:40 AM
So atleast 4 degrees off at the floor. I wonder what temp the peak is at.

I wonder as well, without the ceiling fan running in the shop it can easily be 20 degrees warmer at the peak, but I’m using forced air for heat.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: wreckit87 on November 17, 2017, 06:50:10 AM
I have 3 thermometers around the shop with one at the lid and the other 2 in opposite corners with the wall stat 4ft high in another corner. Both wall thermometers are always within 2 degrees of what the wall stat is (cheap 120V Honeywell) and the one at the lid usually runs about 4 degrees over, no ceiling fans. I really can't tell the difference on the woodpile if the shop floor is calling or not, burn seems to be the same day to day. Now if I turn on the unit heater, different story. That'd get rid of half a cord in a week too probably if I ran it all the time and kept it at 66. I leave the shop at 55 via the floor, and it's sweaty in a T-shirt when working. Unit heater is for when I wanna melt something off quick or sit around and drink beer, but even then 65 will cook me right outta there
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: tinfoilhat2020 on November 17, 2017, 07:52:29 AM
hooking up my 2nd unit heater in the shop hopefully this weekend. got all the parts, started running the unistrut last weekend (yes  Daryn akak wreckit I used a level  ;D ;D ). got to run 80ft of inch copper to the attached shop....should be that back of a job if I can get away from the kiddos for an afternoon. I sure as crap need the heat over there for two reasons: one it would be nice to put more of a load on this boiler and two, it would be nice to take the chill off when im working on something and dry it out on moist rainy days.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 17, 2017, 06:37:59 PM
62 at the peak with IR gun

Got two kids home from college, there goes some hotwater.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: wreckit87 on November 18, 2017, 07:46:44 AM
IR gun really doesn't do well with measuring actual air temp, but the surface of the wall or lid you're pointing it at. Thermometer may be considerably higher.

Dylan, THANK YOU for using a level. I've been losing sleep over that for days lol
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 19, 2017, 12:54:57 PM
I got three more thermometers to distribute around garage, there is one on the back wall 2 degrees different than others and t stat, didn't do anything in peak yet.

Took some thermal imaging of floor , garage door, and walls this morning.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 21, 2017, 03:57:10 PM
Blower door testing came in at 512 cfm, garage is tight.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: mlappin on November 21, 2017, 04:33:09 PM
Blower door testing came in at 512 cfm, garage is tight.

Something still seems weird though, if it was a faulty thermostat causing the excessive wood consumption then you should have noticed it was way too warm in your shop, where’d the extra BTU’s go?
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 21, 2017, 05:16:35 PM
Exactly :post:
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 21, 2017, 05:26:08 PM
 :bash:    Wished I knew.   T stat at 68 tonight, thermometers around the garage are 62, 64 degrees.

Who knows!
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 21, 2017, 06:49:10 PM
Well now that you know all the critical info, you can calc your btu needs for the garage with this calculator. https://www.builditsolar.com/References/Calculators/HeatLoss/HeatLoss.htm

What do you come up with for btus per hour?
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 21, 2017, 07:42:05 PM
15447
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 21, 2017, 09:18:39 PM
At what outside temp was that based on?

I did a calc average of 6500 btus per pound of 20 percent mc wood. Multiply 6500 by .75 for the stove efficiency and you get 4800 btus per pound. Multiply 16,000 btus per hour by 12 hours and you get 192,000 btus per 12 hour burn. Divide 192,000 by 4800 and you get 40 pounds of wood per loading to heat the garage. Obviously these numbers are a little rough but it gives you a starting point of what to expect for wood use.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 22, 2017, 11:50:27 AM
20 degree
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 22, 2017, 03:22:11 PM
Well I don't know if your wood supply is at 20 percent mc which is what I based my 4800 btus per pound off of but do you think you were using 40 extra pounds of wood over your house wood load every 12 hours?
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 22, 2017, 04:04:39 PM
You know I have been meaning for a couple years now to weigh some for a week to check that out.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 22, 2017, 06:04:05 PM
Can you refresh me on the backstory on this? Was this a sudden jump in wood usage or what was the deal?
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 22, 2017, 06:17:45 PM
3 years ago I moved my 250 across the road and ran logstor under road to house and then to garage appr. 50 ft . Used 6 full cord to heat both, next winter used 16 full cord in 250. Same setup.
Last summer bought G200, last winter used 22 full cord. Same setup.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 22, 2017, 06:18:45 PM
Used 2 full cord so far this month.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: mlappin on November 22, 2017, 07:04:36 PM
So…would usage went up 2.5 times from one year to the next with the same stove, then again with a different stove….

I hate to ask the obvious, but was the first winter especially mild compared to the next two? 

This is aggravating, where are the extra BTU’s going….

I’ve used roughly 1.75 cords since starting it up last month and my shop is a sieve compared to yours, but your also having much cooler temps than we are.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 22, 2017, 07:24:06 PM
Was cold that first winter.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: RSI on November 22, 2017, 07:29:36 PM
I would disconnect the underground lines at the opposite end from the boiler and connect supply pipe to return.
Then run boiler and see how much wood it uses.
It should pretty much just idle.
If it still burns a lot of wood then bypass right at the stove and see if that makes a huge difference.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 22, 2017, 08:28:34 PM
Thanks for the reminder on this. So we know that it isn't the boiler if you tripled wood use from 1 year to the next. So ruling that out we know that you are sending the btus somewhere. Dhw is a huge btu hog. There isn't something strange like a super leaky hot water issue somewhere possibly? You would know if the house was 90 degrees all the time. Unfortunately everything points to ground water heat loss. I know it is Logstor but hey I guess anything is possible. I am with Rsi. Sunday it is suppose to be warm in New England. You should bypass the house and heat with your backup. Just send the water to the house and back. I get 6 plus hours of idle when nothing is calling with my 75 feet of Logstor and g200.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 23, 2017, 06:30:04 AM
Interesting ideas!   I took these photos the other night.  Garage was up to temp.
First one is the Logstor with three inches of closed cell foam on it.
Second is the surface of the Logstor, no foam on it.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 23, 2017, 06:36:29 AM
Yesterday i moved my T stat about 8 ft from where it had been since garage was built, it is now about 6ft high.
Garage was calling for heat when i cut the wire, after reconnecting pump ran for about 30 seconds and shut of.
Last night (8pm) put wood in about bottom of door high this morning (8am) still had coals to relight. 25 degrees overnight.
I might be on to something.
Cant tell anything until college kids go back!
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 23, 2017, 07:04:26 AM
Some temp readings from Controly Web thingy from last Sunday.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: mlappin on November 23, 2017, 07:08:46 AM
College kids or not, never seen the house pull more than 5 degrees, the shop however always seems to be pulling 15.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 23, 2017, 07:35:36 AM
It looks like the shop loop loses 4 degrees round trip when not calling for heat right? If it loses 4 degrees and you are flowing 8 gpm that means that it takes 25 mins to turn over the water in the 200 gallon g200. So every 25 mins you lose 4 degrees from jut idling. So your boiler is going to go from 180-160 every 2.5 hours just idling! It is actually even less time because the house loses some too. I can go 6 plus hours on not heat call idling. You are cycling less than every 2.5 hours of nothing calls for heat. Everything is starting to point to the line set from boiler to garage.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 23, 2017, 08:08:27 AM
Got some exploratory digging to do me thinks, or replace and be done, fingers, toes crossed problem found.
I will dig some by hand and take some temp readings with Flir.
Good reason to buy a hoe for the Bota?
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: mlappin on November 23, 2017, 09:02:56 AM
If your losing that much heat to the underground, I’m surprised your FLIR wouldn’t show a heck of a warm spot somewhere compared to the rest of the ground.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: Pointblank on November 23, 2017, 09:44:22 AM
Does seem to point toward ground losss. Have you noticed any spots on the ground where the snow melts or the ground doesn't freeze?
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 23, 2017, 10:00:40 AM
I would swap the sensors that are reading the shop supply and return temps to ensure that that they are both accurate. One could be reading low or high compared to the other.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 23, 2017, 01:28:52 PM
Does seem to point toward ground losss. Have you noticed any spots on the ground where the snow melts or the ground doesn't freeze?

Haven't seen any, but I am going to go out when it gets dark to check things out.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 23, 2017, 02:32:31 PM
Some temp readings from Controly Web thingy from last Sunday.

Can't go by these readings, I looked at the day, last Sunday and the shop was calling for heat all day.
This is one from today with nothing calling for heat.

Just moving my T stat has made a HUGE difference today anyway.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 23, 2017, 03:28:58 PM
Is that after swapping the supply and return probes on the shop lines?
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on November 23, 2017, 03:34:40 PM
It looks like I had misread one of the screen shots. I thought I read one of them said a delta t of 4 but now I don’t see that so I must have misread.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: mlappin on November 23, 2017, 04:18:22 PM
Some temp readings from Controly Web thingy from last Sunday.

Can't go by these readings, I looked at the day, last Sunday and the shop was calling for heat all day.
This is one from today with nothing calling for heat.

Just moving my T stat has made a HUGE difference today anyway.

I’m glad your heading this thing off, but with radiant I can’t see why thermostat placement could make that big a deal, if it was in a cold spot in the building then the rest should feel too warm.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on November 23, 2017, 06:31:35 PM
I haven't swapped any probes yet, kids absolutely NEED wifi extender, thus I can't access controlyweb.

I also put my old digital T stat along with 2 regular thermometers in same area old t stat was, of course all three read differently, but digital was 5 degrees colder than new one.

I also did a very small amount of digging( stuffed belly) and took some Flir temps.
First is Logstor going up through to boiler.
Second third fourth, are temp reading through my hole in closed cell foam.
Last three are the little area I dug up.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on December 03, 2017, 05:45:27 AM
I dont know how else we can isolate this issue without historical graphing of the heat loads taking heat from the boiler and the temperature losses while the water is circulating around the loop.

I also assume your g200 is gassing correct? How long are the cycle times? We may have
Covered that once before. This has been going for so long I can't remember.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on December 03, 2017, 06:25:41 AM
I am just throwing wood in, and get more when needed.
I will burn through what wood I have, then I am done with it.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on December 03, 2017, 06:34:59 AM
Done with what? The g200? You said that your wood usage spiked when using your pm250. So why would your wood use spike with the pm250 and continue to be high with the g200 but the g200 is the issue?

If the g200 is gassing then that's not the issue. If it is not
Gassing then that is a problem.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on December 03, 2017, 08:07:58 AM
Done with wood.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on December 03, 2017, 09:43:35 AM
I don't blame you with that much wood use. What alternative are you going to?
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on December 03, 2017, 09:57:14 AM
Oil for the house and probably propane for shop, not shure yet.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: mlappin on December 03, 2017, 04:29:19 PM
really wish I was closer to you coolidge, the heat is going somewhere. It’s getting worse as well. I might be jaded so take my opinion with a grain of salt, but the first year you said you burnt like 7 or 8 cord, then up to 12 or 14 wit the P&M 250 then up again with the G200, can’t be the G200’s fault as it jumped from the first to second year then again the third whence my comment about it getting worse. It’s aggravating to no end that you can’t find the loss.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: hondaracer2oo4 on December 03, 2017, 04:33:13 PM
I Agree. I am probably less than two hours away but between having a 1 year old and my wife and I both working full and doing no day care it is hard to find any free time to pay a visit.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on December 03, 2017, 06:24:14 PM
There is no explanation. I would think with using the controlyweb on the lines would tell you if there is ground loss.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: tinfoilhat2020 on December 03, 2017, 07:31:51 PM
how close is richard aka slimijim? i know hes banned on here sp he cant chime in but maybe he cpuld come take a look?
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on December 04, 2017, 03:34:19 AM
how close is richard aka slimijim? i know hes banned on here sp he cant chime in but maybe he cpuld come take a look?


He is going to stop by after done installs.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on December 04, 2017, 10:03:58 AM
This is garage setup, first pic is where the Logstor enters the garage.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: coolidge on December 04, 2017, 02:55:19 PM
I guess circulating water creates heat, house returns hotter than supply. :bash: :bash: :bash:
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: woodman on December 08, 2017, 05:44:33 AM
I have not really been following this thread so I don't know all the details of the problem, but it sounds like you are not happy with the wood consumption of your system and are trying to figure out where all the btu's are going, correct? I also am not sure if this has been suggested yet, sorry if it has. What I did was isolate my underground pipe where it enters the house. It takes 3 valves and 1 loop, similar to the bypass of a water softener. Then get a 5 gallon bucket and pull the return pipe off the owb and catch the water for 20 seconds. Measure and multiply by 3, you now know your gpm through just the underground pipe. Build a small fire to get your boiler up to high set point then turn off the fan, noting what time it is. Let the circulator loop through only the boiler and underground line, the longer the better but at least 4 hours. At that point check the water temp at boiler and figure btu loss. It is a pain in the neck but it will tell you if there is a problem with the underground line set. No more guessing.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: mlappin on December 08, 2017, 08:16:15 AM
I guess circulating water creates heat, house returns hotter than supply. :bash: :bash: :bash:

I used honeywell gauges in the basement setup, I had the same thing, I contributed it to my superior design and craftsmanship.  ;D
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: shepherd boy on December 08, 2017, 03:15:14 PM
 Ran into the same thing on a stove in Pa. that my son-in- law did a service call on. Return temp gauge was higher than feed (amongst other whacky things). Didn't ask what brand it was.

 I guess you could switch gauges and then brag on how well your furnace runs with a big delta.
Title: Re: Almost
Post by: Smokeless on December 22, 2017, 08:02:55 PM
Hello Coolidge
   Was slim Jim able to come out to your place and figure anything out for you?

   It sounds like something is running backwards flow. from the looks of the temp readings. The Logstor has a red marker on the hot supply to house or garage. Then a plain white pipe on the returns to the boiler. It would be worth checking this out. Also make sure the Circs are going in the directions intended.
 
 Do you have drainage under the slab ? And could the drain be plugged if a daylight drain.
   If plugged , Is the slab losing heat Threw moisture soaked insulation?
Are you running antifreeze in systems?
Can you take a dime size piece of Logstor insulation and squeeze it flat between your fingers.
 Look threw the bottom clean out of the furnace at the bottom of the nozzle ceramic and make sure it is not broken out or away. Some cracks will occurs.
 The furnace should not be smoking, any blue or black smoke.
  How long is your water recovery taking with no heat emitters on?
Do you have thermal limiting valves on the in floor manifold?
  Sorry for your troubles and frustration. As Honda  said. I wish we were closer to come see you !!