Outdoor Wood Furnace Info
All-Purpose OWF Discussions => General Outdoor Furnace Discussion => Topic started by: arkgac5 on May 10, 2018, 09:33:24 PM
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Last Thursday evening, one of our many oak trees fell on my Shaver 165 boiler. It has been in service 10-11 years. It is not damaged beyond repair, but is heavily damaged. My insurance company has stated they will replace it.
I buy my wood, so I am not getting "Free Heat". I have calculated in the past that propane needs to be around $1.20 per gal or less to be comparable to my wood costs for the season. My last full season use of propane was 1000 gal. I think that was before I insulated my floors. I have a farm house built in 1917. It is fairly energy efficient, except for the old double hung windows with storms over them.
Last summer, I had to repair a leak in the bottom of the water jacket. It appeared that other leaks may be over the horizon. I reworked the insulation and seals before last season, getting good burns throughout last winter. Probably the best I have ever gotten.
Since Shaver is gone, should I just take the money and run to my propane supplier, or should I look toward another boiler purchase? I know I keep my house a few degrees warmer with the boiler, than I did with the propane furnace. I also enjoy my endless supply of hot water. I tend to get fewer complaints from my wife and daughter when the hot water is in plenty supply. BTW, my propane furnace is approaching 15 years old, but has been used little since installing the Shaver 11 years ago.
Any advice on my next move?
Thanks
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Since you are buying wood, the price difference for a good gasser would definitely be worth the difference even if you could still get a new Shaver.
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And, with the rise in crude oil prices recently perhaps a new gasser is in your future. My $0.02 worth. Roger
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I would agree with Roger, I'd be very nervous about going to propane with the volatility in the world right now.
I think you'd be pleasantly surprised with the convenience and efficiency of a new gasser compared to the Shaver.
Just thinking- Insurance should replace with an equivalent. a conventional unit isn't a legal option so they should cover a current legal model?
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Just thinking- Insurance should replace with an equivalent. a conventional unit isn't a legal option so they should cover a current legal model?
You’d be surprised, I was. A friend that is a LEO with our town had a Woodmaster 4400 on a chunk of stress core. Straight line winds came thru and slid it right off the back of the pad, was in use yet so kinked the lines and broke one of them, pumped the water out while it still had a fire in it. He was talking to me about a G200, insurance company paid for another Woodmaster 4400 out of Michigan even though the friend made sure they knew about both the Federal law regarding boilers and the state one. Seems the insurance companies stance was they’d only pay for a direct replacement, as in exact same model and brand.
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Well then he's out of luck with a Shaver. ?
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Well then he's out of luck with a Shaver. ?
Most likely then they will only pay for another conventional, anything to get away with paying less. I fought the b*stards for over 2 years after getting rear ended, and they did everything possible to low ball me.
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Is your LP furnace a high efficiency unit? If it is not you could upgrade to a high efficiency and cost even less for LP.
Last year I did a summer fill on my LP tank for 79.9 cents per gallon and could have pre-ordered for the year for the same price. I haven't checked what it is going for now. There are pro's and con's to both just be honest about what the true cost (and time) is when it comes to burning wood.
I thought I had a 3 year supply going into this last heating season but after going through 14 full cord this last winter I will be lucky to make it 2 years from what I had cut. Sometimes it can feel like I'm a wood slave especially since my kids have grown and don't help much anymore.
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Look around for tax credits for replacing your windows and propane furnace. See what it will cost and what size check the insurance company is going to cut you. You might do well to replace the windows, put in a high efficiency furnace, and spend your money on propane instead of wood. You can even upgrade your water heater to a larger one or an on demand propane model to solve that problem.
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Is your LP furnace a high efficiency unit? If it is not you could upgrade to a high efficiency and cost even less for LP.
Last year I did a summer fill on my LP tank for 79.9 cents per gallon and could have pre-ordered for the year for the same price. I haven't checked what it is going for now. There are pro's and con's to both just be honest about what the true cost (and time) is when it comes to burning wood.
I thought I had a 3 year supply going into this last heating season but after going through 14 full cord this last winter I will be lucky to make it 2 years from what I had cut. Sometimes it can feel like I'm a wood slave especially since my kids have grown and don't help much anymore.
I think propane has gone up a fair amount since then.
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Thanks to all for your advice.
I received two quotes for replacement units. The G200 HeatMaster quote is $11,500 delivered and installed with hot water option. The nearest dealer is 90 miles from me. The second quote from the company that installed my propane furnace is for an E-100 Ozark Biomass boiler for $6650, delivered and installed. The second option is not EPA compliant for residential. Didn't seem to be an issue with them.
For all the issues with the Shaver, It has kept my home warm and hot water in good supply. All for much less than the cost of propane. I will also have about half of my wood needs met with the very tree that damaged my Shaver. Although the G200 is my desire, repair of the Shaver is more economical. I will have to replace some of the skin, repair some of the filler plumbing on the top, and rebuild the tube frame for the skin in top. The damage appears worse than it is. I can see this after sawing off the part of the tree that damaged it. A new bottom for the water jacket would add years of life as well. All cost far less than the G200.
My brief research on the E-100 from the local company says that it falls in the same class as the Shaver. I don't want to spend money on equivalent technology. Does anyone have experience with the E-100 Ozark Biomass boiler?
What the insurance company pays for is still to be determined. BTW, the local company said my 90% efficient propane furnace is still in great condition. No need to make a change there.
Thanks again for your help.
Jerry
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LP was right around a buck here last fall. As of about a month ago I called to check and it was $1.80
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FYI, A G200s would run yah roughly $2K less.
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I don't think that Ozark E-100 would be big enough. If it is, then a HeatMaster G100 probably would work.
The GS100 would probably be $3-$4k less than the quote you got for the G200. (assuming it was actually for the G and not the GS)
Here is a chart for propane prices I just found. https://www.eia.gov/dnav/pet/pet_pri_wfr_a_EPLLPA_PRS_dpgal_w.htm
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If you can repair the old boiler cheaply, that might be the best route to go. Perhaps get another couple years out of it and budget for a new replacement down the road.
When it comes time to replace, purchasing your wood would make a good arguement for a gasifier. If your breaking even at $1.20/propane now, you'll be able to drive that well below 1.00 with a gasifier. That's still some pretty inexpensive heat if your willing to put in the labor. Besides, propane prices always fluctuate and seldom remains on the low end of the scale.
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To me it would depend on the amount the insurance company is going to give you towards replacement.
From reading on the forums over the years if your Shaver lasted 11 years you're doing something right, but as you mentioned that it has a leak now I think it's days are numbered.
Depending on the amount they're offering I would really be considering replacing the Shaver.
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The E100 is rated at 1800 sq ft., Sounds smaller than your Shaver.
A GS100 is rated at around 3000 sq ft and sells for around $7,000.
Just comparing equal sizes.
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If you are not concerned about EPA, You have choices. The E 100 and E 200 are cheap but only a 3yr. warranty. Heatmaster has a WF4000 commercial labeled unit for under $6000. Limited lifetime warranty and stainless. Not that I'm telling you to put that unit to a house, but If you're going to do it get the best deal for your dollar.