Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?

Username: Password:
Pages: 1 2 [3] 4

Author Topic: CENTRAL E Leaks (Not Like the onion)  (Read 16280 times)

johnybcold

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 376
  • OWF Brand: Central Boiler
  • OWF Model: Classic E1400
    • View Profile
Re: CENTRAL E Leaks (Not Like the onion)
« Reply #30 on: February 21, 2013, 07:37:06 PM »

I would like to thank all the regulars for commenting here, I was starting to think my e1400, might be a ticking time bomb.
Logged
old truck
old craftsman chain saw
Polaris Sportsman 500HO

victor6deep

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 393
  • OWF Brand: Burnrite
  • OWF Model: 228
    • View Profile
Re: CENTRAL E Leaks (Not Like the onion)
« Reply #31 on: February 21, 2013, 07:40:23 PM »

I would like to thank all the regulars for commenting here, I was starting to think my e1400, might be a ticking time bomb.

It is a ticking time bomb, you just don't know it yet....LOL
Logged

Scott7m

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3740
  • OWF Brand: Heatmaster
  • OWF Model: E Series
    • View Profile
Re: CENTRAL E Leaks (Not Like the onion)
« Reply #32 on: February 21, 2013, 08:27:44 PM »

Johnny, just always do your best maintenance you can...   

Boilerman, yea it is incredible the neglect we see, people are to lazy to do anything it seems sometimes


I recently tested my empyre xt 100 to see how long it would go before clogging the tubes....   I let her go for 7 weeks with 0 cleaning, 1 tube did clog, 2 more partially closed off, but I was still able to get it clean with the brush, I think that's impresssive considering the fact I was using no additives, if I were using the proformer, perhaps I could have went 10-12 weeks.... 
Logged
Dealer for:  Heatmaster, Empyre, Earth, Ridgewood, and Woodmaster outdoor furnaces
Furnace Parts Dealer
Pelican water treatment systems
606-316-9697

whiteyford1

  • Training Wheels
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 22
  • OWF Brand: Taylor
  • OWF Model: 750
  • Make every day count!
    • View Profile
    • Wimers Welding Service
Re: CENTRAL E Leaks (Not Like the onion)
« Reply #33 on: February 22, 2013, 05:00:43 AM »

Hey thanks again to everyone for contributing. Let's get caught up; Taylor 750 1992 s, purchased used 06, $ 2000/7= 286/year and getting better, manadatory 2hrs maint. Time/ year. I know its a pig using 9 or 10 cord a year.
 Water levels; My point is make sure the fire box is submerged 100% of the time. Some liquid temp sensors require liquid on them to be accurate.
Boilerman; no offense but your playing checkers,,,I'm playing chess. You skipped right over the answer. Unfortunately there is nothing any dealer can sell to fix this. Remember this pertains to gassers.
Here's some 9 year old stainless, patched up at the factory, see pen in pic, I repaired a 4 places on it. It'l need more work within two years. 5500 investested + 600 for repairs 6100 /10 = $610/ year HMM. Customers fight with justifying an investment, just like my customer yesterday, salesman told him 20 years then went out of business. It would be fine if the longevity curve was growing but it's not. Gotta go spend my weekend repairing a drill rig derrick ahh fun work!

[attachment deleted by admin]
« Last Edit: February 22, 2013, 05:10:10 AM by whiteyford1 »
Logged

Scott7m

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3740
  • OWF Brand: Heatmaster
  • OWF Model: E Series
    • View Profile
Re: CENTRAL E Leaks (Not Like the onion)
« Reply #34 on: February 22, 2013, 09:17:23 AM »

The dealer isn't the one who writes the warranty,  if the customer had kept his treatment levels proper every year cb would be paying you instead of him paying you.  Regardless of the dealer, cb is still in business
Logged
Dealer for:  Heatmaster, Empyre, Earth, Ridgewood, and Woodmaster outdoor furnaces
Furnace Parts Dealer
Pelican water treatment systems
606-316-9697

woodman

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 245
  • OWF Brand: hawken
  • OWF Model: he1000
    • View Profile
Re: CENTRAL E Leaks (Not Like the onion)
« Reply #35 on: February 22, 2013, 10:57:27 AM »

Is this thread some kind of joke or something? What do you think is going to happen if you continue to fire your boiler if it is low on water? Let the water chemistry get out of wack and guess what? Hmm.....,,, I wonder what will happen if I never clean the ashes out and let rain come down  the chimney all summer? Nice pen by the way  >:D.   
Logged

whiteyford1

  • Training Wheels
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 22
  • OWF Brand: Taylor
  • OWF Model: 750
  • Make every day count!
    • View Profile
    • Wimers Welding Service
Re: CENTRAL E Leaks (Not Like the onion)
« Reply #36 on: February 22, 2013, 11:44:33 AM »

Woodman;  woodman how convenient that you noticed the pen. Yea you get a free one when you buy em 100 at a time:)).  From what I've seen most stoves have a visual level gauge and won't circulate if the level gets below the pickup tube. I'm just saying watch you water level closely.
As far as jokes go not here.
 I'm here to help anyone who has concerns, issues and to let the dealers and manufacturers know someone is educating their customers.
Of course the dealers are educated by the company and really honestly believe what theyre told. 
So its no joke,  the people that buy these typically don't park the mercedes next to the woodshed. Be it for a dollar or a dime we all work hard for our money. The big guys don't care, obvious in the way they compete to write the crumiest warranty. How about you dealers get some extra units ready on trailers for emergencies and warranty work. Poor old fella yesterday is froze up solid till things thaw out and had buy 1200 in fuel to get by.
No joke! The only way I would buy one of these is if my dealer promised to provide a back up system within 24 hrs if it goes to crap.
How about that 10k stove, lease it to me (not lease to buy) for say $10,000/120 months 10 years = $83.00/month Charge me an even hundred and and the dealer does whatever maint is required and earn another 20%. That puts performance and maint. back on the people bragging about thier stove and takes all the lazy fire tenders out of the picture.
 I would encourage anyone to actually negotiate some "what if's" into the purchase. Oops gotta run another one bit the dust.
Randy
« Last Edit: February 22, 2013, 12:50:40 PM by whiteyford1 »
Logged

Scott7m

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3740
  • OWF Brand: Heatmaster
  • OWF Model: E Series
    • View Profile
Re: CENTRAL E Leaks (Not Like the onion)
« Reply #37 on: February 22, 2013, 02:04:27 PM »

You know at first I was giving you benefit of the doubt, now you seem so out of touch with reality that its not worth the debate anymore.

Water gets below the level of the supply!?  Do what, in "most" stoves that would mean you've lost about 80% of your water.

How about this?  How about you it your money where your mouth is???  You build a company and do your lease program, I wanna see how that turns out for ya.

You've made claims against a lot and then openly admit, your learning the industry, and that you don't like this kind of work. 

Do you not realize how outrageous it sounds to pop up out of the blue as the savior?  To think that out of all these million dollar companies that they've just not been lucky enough to find someone like you? 

Did you lease your Taylor!?  Did someone promise you a backup within 24 hours? 

Building what ifs into the warranty/deal?  Here is a what if, hey customer, "if" you neglect to treat your water, if you neglect to have it tested, if you do nothing that is required of you as part of the agreement in which the warranty states, then don't be bugging me about it if the company don't stand behind it.  That's as silly as thinking a car manufacturer should honor cars in which there owners never change the oil for 100k, it ain't reality.  Anytime there is a warranty, there is some responsibility on the part of the customer, like it or not. 

"If" the customer has held up there end of the agreement, and they have issues, I will go to bat for them and hold my 200k dollar order over there head until there taken care of.   Once again, no we the dealers should not stock stoves simply because one might fail, we aren't the ones writing the warranties, that's the job of the manufacturer.  It is the dealers roll to assist the customer in dealing with the company to resolve the issues at hand.  At the same time, if the customer has done there part, and the company knows it and I have another stove like that on my yard, I'll work with the company to replace it with one I have, but not if its 7 years down the road and there warranty is 60% coverage at that point. 

This whole "another one bites the dust", some seek the wise and others want what the wise man has", is nothing short of total arrogance, backed up by some pics of you welding on a stove.  As far as central worrying about you "educating there customers", what are they gonna say, hey I read a post from a guy online who welded armor on tanks and worked on some bridge jobs and he says ur a crook and an idiot, yep, I see that going real far......

If your truly interested in why some stoves fail, do a lot of reading, there is more going on than simply bad welds or poor steel, there are bad companies, don't get me wrong, but everything just isn't black and white, so far I feel you do have a good idea of steel and welding practices, but not so much the hydronic/water side of it.  Most definitely not the business side of it, central boiler don't build stoves to help ol buddy boy out, there in business, business exists when someone has a need and you build something to fulfill that need, and turn a profit doing so.  If you build things that are crap, it will come back on you, people will quit buying your products and the free market will help dictate what people are spending there money on.. 

Oops, gotta go, another happy customer walked in with his neighbor to buy a stove, "sounds hideous don't it". 
Logged
Dealer for:  Heatmaster, Empyre, Earth, Ridgewood, and Woodmaster outdoor furnaces
Furnace Parts Dealer
Pelican water treatment systems
606-316-9697

whiteyford1

  • Training Wheels
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 22
  • OWF Brand: Taylor
  • OWF Model: 750
  • Make every day count!
    • View Profile
    • Wimers Welding Service
Re: CENTRAL E Leaks (Not Like the onion)
« Reply #38 on: February 22, 2013, 05:15:23 PM »

WOW I see what popcorn was about now!

First I like fixing things, most appreciate what I do for them and I make a new friend, but then I don't like eating dirt. So 2++ and 1-

What do you call the pump circut taking the hot water to the house? I call it a supply line?I suppose what I call the fill line could b.....?

I know my local dealer and friend feels like he's been hung out to dry by CB. He knows the conditions of these gassers and told me to be on call, honest engine.
After getting into repairing these gasification boilers, I reviewed an old paper done for the dept of defense regarding the quantum physics of atomic hydrogen, hydrogen isotopes, heat and pressure on steel and alloys. Then I realized that all the stuff sold to,"guarantee the longest life from your stove" likely does very little for the first thing to fail, the fire box, usually 80% of the time. Still maintain ph and inhibitor.
Every action performed on steel and most stainless; bend, roll, cut, or weld it, hydrogen is added. Remember the Hindenburg, its bad. Now expose that steel to heat cycles and time Take a look at yesterdays pics I posted of 409 Stainless/9 years old. The blue heat line from factory welding is still visible with the leaks dead in the center of the heat line /weld. Note weld is on the opposite side. 



Chickfillet question of the day: what metal is enhanced inside a wood boiler fire box? -0- I win.
Your move?
Randy
« Last Edit: February 22, 2013, 05:24:17 PM by whiteyford1 »
Logged

Scott7m

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3740
  • OWF Brand: Heatmaster
  • OWF Model: E Series
    • View Profile
Re: CENTRAL E Leaks (Not Like the onion)
« Reply #39 on: February 22, 2013, 05:20:33 PM »

Most supply lines are located about 12" above the bottom of the water jacket, if they've lost that much water, they'd know it
Logged
Dealer for:  Heatmaster, Empyre, Earth, Ridgewood, and Woodmaster outdoor furnaces
Furnace Parts Dealer
Pelican water treatment systems
606-316-9697

whiteyford1

  • Training Wheels
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 22
  • OWF Brand: Taylor
  • OWF Model: 750
  • Make every day count!
    • View Profile
    • Wimers Welding Service
Re: CENTRAL E Leaks (Not Like the onion)
« Reply #40 on: February 22, 2013, 05:30:49 PM »

Ahh that's where they enter the stove, internally the hottest water is at the high water level, the ones I've disected pull hot water from 4-6 inches below the high water level???
Thanks Randy
Logged

willieG

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1852
  • owbinfo.com
    • View Profile
Re: CENTRAL E Leaks (Not Like the onion)
« Reply #41 on: February 22, 2013, 05:34:59 PM »

off topic question maybe?

my brother in law has had a CB (non gasser) for about 12 years..ii would say not a good "maintence man"
and he has never had a leak, his stove sits outside and the only thing that has ever happened to it as far as i know is the blower fan rusted off and he had to repair that (not a big deal)

is he doing something right (by not doing anything at all) or is he just a lucky SOB

i have seen all brands in my area have hard luck early in thier usage and like my brother in law i have seen some go for what seems like forever
Logged
home made OWB (2012)
Ontario Canada

Scott7m

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3740
  • OWF Brand: Heatmaster
  • OWF Model: E Series
    • View Profile
Re: CENTRAL E Leaks (Not Like the onion)
« Reply #42 on: February 22, 2013, 05:36:25 PM »

Ahh that's where they enter the stove, internally the hottest water is at the high water level, the ones I've disected pull hot water from 4-6 inches below the high water level???
Thanks Randy

Well none of the stoves I carry do that..  Pulling hot water at the top and returning cold at the bottom does nothing to promote circulation inside the water jacket, if you have 170 degree water at the top and 130 at the bottom your gonna have some big problems fast...   

Most stoves I've seen have the returns at the top, supply lines at the bottom for this very reason....  That in itself could make stoves last a lot longer...
Logged
Dealer for:  Heatmaster, Empyre, Earth, Ridgewood, and Woodmaster outdoor furnaces
Furnace Parts Dealer
Pelican water treatment systems
606-316-9697

Scott7m

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3740
  • OWF Brand: Heatmaster
  • OWF Model: E Series
    • View Profile
Re: CENTRAL E Leaks (Not Like the onion)
« Reply #43 on: February 22, 2013, 05:38:27 PM »

off topic question maybe?

my brother in law has had a CB (non gasser) for about 12 years..ii would say not a good "maintence man"
and he has never had a leak, his stove sits outside and the only thing that has ever happened to it as far as i know is the blower fan rusted off and he had to repair that (not a big deal)

is he doing something right (by not doing anything at all) or is he just a lucky SOB

i have seen all brands in my area have hard luck early in thier usage and like my brother in law i have seen some go for what seems like forever

The water treatment would have no adverse affects, initial water quality could be helping him as much as anything.    My thoughts anyways lol
Logged
Dealer for:  Heatmaster, Empyre, Earth, Ridgewood, and Woodmaster outdoor furnaces
Furnace Parts Dealer
Pelican water treatment systems
606-316-9697

whiteyford1

  • Training Wheels
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 22
  • OWF Brand: Taylor
  • OWF Model: 750
  • Make every day count!
    • View Profile
    • Wimers Welding Service
Re: CENTRAL E Leaks (Not Like the onion)
« Reply #44 on: February 22, 2013, 05:49:37 PM »

I realize some stoves have some trick internal plumbing. I have used a temp gun on a few stoves to check water jacket temp, 40 degrees bottom to top difference was typical. Also I think it was an 80s Aqua II I disected put an internal domestic hot water coil internally and placed it mid point in the tank I guess since it didn't have to be as hot. Just my 2cents.
Randy
Logged
Pages: 1 2 [3] 4