Outdoor Wood Furnace Info
Outdoor Furnaces - Manufacturers WITH EPA-Certified Models => Central Boiler => Topic started by: duramax on December 10, 2018, 05:16:50 PM
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Anyone try this out yet or know someone who does? It looks to be an energy saving pump, variable speed on demand. My electric bill goes up $30 or more every month when the boiler is on.
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Is that similar to the Grundfos Alfa? The Grundfos Alfa does the exact same thing, variable speed on demand. Not only am I hoping that it'll save a bit money but when all of the zones call for heat, it'll ramp up to meet the demand. Roger
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What pump do you have now?
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I think the 007e is a basic fixed speed ecm replacement for the old faithful psc 007. Not the greatest for long runs as it's a somewhat low head pump compared even to an alpha.
All going off memory, I haven't used a 007e.
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I have a 007e on my M250 at present. It will soon be replaced for a high flow high head unit when I get my heating system reworked. I have had no problems with it and would recommend it for sure. I hope to go with a large Taco for my next pump.
:thumbup:
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What pump do you have now?
I have the Taco 007 now.
Is that similar to the Grundfos Alfa? The Grundfos Alfa does the exact same thing, variable speed on demand. Not only am I hoping that it'll save a bit money but when all of the zones call for heat, it'll ramp up to meet the demand. Roger
Yea from the youtube I saw on it it is variable speed on demand. They claim it will self purge any air pockets or shut down if it gets any clogs. In the video they talk about some energy savings rebate for it, I need to see if that is true. I have a heat exchanger in the basement separating the house from the boiler so I don't need a pump running at max speed 24/7. The good part is it is the same size as the 007 .
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It's a circulator, not a centrifugal. It will not purge air any better than any other circ we use in these systems (but they do claim to self purge the pump housing, which is feasible). I see a few of them here and there, seem to be decent for what they are and the price is good compared to an Alpha if your only objective is saving a couple bucks on power. I would never put one on a mild steel boiler though, any ferrous metals in the water will collect at the ECM (magnet) motor and wreck it
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Just curious, why would it collect at the permanent magnet any more than it does at the electromagnet of a regular pump?
I have two Armstong ECM pumps on my boiler and so far been going good. I guess time will tell but I have not heard or any excessive failures of Alpha pumps and they have been getting used on outdoor boilers for quite a few years now.
Even if you have an 007 pump already, that doesn't necessarily mean that is is the best size. Actually an 007 is almost never a good choice for an outdoor boiler since it has a max of less than 10' of head pressure. But if the pipe is short and has minimal restriction you can get 3-5 gpm with them.
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I'm not sure on specifics of why, I know less than most children about electronics so please take this with a grain of salt BUT I've attended a few hydronics training courses and diagnostic seminars where this subject was addressed. Not particularly with OWB, but the closed systems with cast iron boilers and radiators apparently wreak havoc with ECM circs due to the particles floating around in the system. Call me paranoid, but after seeing some of the pictures and hearing some of the chatter at these meetings I'm not going to be the one to recommend an ECM in an application where only $2 a month is saved with the chance of killing the circ. I've put a few Alphas on stainless OWB and really like the technology, but the mild steel units scare me unless there is another means of collection such as a mag filter.
Very good point on the pump sizing though, the 007 is almost never a good choice
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Well, I guess we will just have to wait and see how they hold up.
Here is how my match comes out:
Grundfos 15-58 uses roughly 2 KWH per day so 60 per month. $0.13 x 60 = $7.80 per month
Armstrong 20-20CI uses about 32 KWH per month $0.13 x 32 = $4.16 per month
So running it for 6 months saves a little over $20. I get $40 more for a 20-20CI pump than a 15-58 so the break even time is 2 years.
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What pump do you have now?
I have the Taco 007 now.
Is that similar to the Grundfos Alfa? The Grundfos Alfa does the exact same thing, variable speed on demand. Not only am I hoping that it'll save a bit money but when all of the zones call for heat, it'll ramp up to meet the demand. Roger
Yea from the youtube I saw on it it is variable speed on demand. They claim it will self purge any air pockets or shut down if it gets any clogs. In the video they talk about some energy savings rebate for it, I need to see if that is true. I have a heat exchanger in the basement separating the house from the boiler so I don't need a pump running at max speed 24/7. The good part is it is the same size as the 007 .
A delta T pump might work better then. Only runs as fast as required to maintain the Delta T that you set.