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1
General Outdoor Furnace Discussion / Re: It's cold out there
« on: December 12, 2013, 06:28:20 PM »
It's been below average up here in the wilderness of Maine. It's 4 out right now and the high today was 11.
It's supposed to be -5 tonite and 5 or 6 tomorrow.
I can also see my wood pile shrinking much faster than I thought it would.
Time to head out back and cut some yellow birch. I've got some monsters out there. They burn pretty damn good actually. Even green.
It's supposed to be -5 tonite and 5 or 6 tomorrow.
I can also see my wood pile shrinking much faster than I thought it would.
Time to head out back and cut some yellow birch. I've got some monsters out there. They burn pretty damn good actually. Even green.
2
General Outdoor Furnace Discussion / Re: Proper fan speed, forced draft question.
« on: December 12, 2013, 06:22:58 PM »
First, thanks to everyone for all of the info!
I can see the consensus is open damper with high fan speed. That's what I was thinking also.
I assume the idea is to get the wood burning super hot and super fast with minimal cycle times.
I'm going to try a higher fan speed along with openings damper much more than it is.
Ill let you know what happens.
Thanks again everyone!
I can see the consensus is open damper with high fan speed. That's what I was thinking also.
I assume the idea is to get the wood burning super hot and super fast with minimal cycle times.
I'm going to try a higher fan speed along with openings damper much more than it is.
Ill let you know what happens.
Thanks again everyone!
3
General Outdoor Furnace Discussion / Proper fan speed, forced draft question.
« on: December 04, 2013, 08:04:12 AM »
I've been running the outdoor boiler I built for 6 weeks or so. Knock on wood, everything seems to be going good so far.
I've been fine tuning the boiler operation since I started it up. Slow fan with open flue damper, fast fan with partially closed damper, covered slots in grate, open slots etc...
My question:
Is there any "rule of thumb" for those who run forced draft boilers? Should the fan be on high speed, forcing tons of air into firebox to create a super hot, fast burning fire to heat the water very fast?
Should the fan be slowed down to create a more "stable" fire similar to the rate at which a regular woodstove burns? I'm thinking it would end up using more wood due to the cooler fire.
I currently have the fan turned up quite high and have very little visible smoke coming out of the chimney when the boiler is cycling.
I'm just curious what the rest of you have found to be the most efficient combination of fan speed, damper settings and whatever else you all do.
Thanks everyone!!
I've been fine tuning the boiler operation since I started it up. Slow fan with open flue damper, fast fan with partially closed damper, covered slots in grate, open slots etc...
My question:
Is there any "rule of thumb" for those who run forced draft boilers? Should the fan be on high speed, forcing tons of air into firebox to create a super hot, fast burning fire to heat the water very fast?
Should the fan be slowed down to create a more "stable" fire similar to the rate at which a regular woodstove burns? I'm thinking it would end up using more wood due to the cooler fire.
I currently have the fan turned up quite high and have very little visible smoke coming out of the chimney when the boiler is cycling.
I'm just curious what the rest of you have found to be the most efficient combination of fan speed, damper settings and whatever else you all do.
Thanks everyone!!
4
Home Made / Re: New Build Pics and a Few Questions.
« on: September 08, 2013, 06:37:02 PM »
I thank you very much for your input!
You have answered my questions quite well.
Any chance you know a model of blower with a flap which is tried an true? I've seen a few while searching around online but haven't decided which one is best. I'd like one which would offer an airtight seal and reliable operation.
Thanks again.
You have answered my questions quite well.
Any chance you know a model of blower with a flap which is tried an true? I've seen a few while searching around online but haven't decided which one is best. I'd like one which would offer an airtight seal and reliable operation.
Thanks again.
5
Plumbing / Re: underground pex
« on: September 08, 2013, 05:52:08 AM »I looked on the home Depot site and they have quickete hydyaulic water stop cement. Might just use that. wonder if anyone used it?
I've done excavating and septic system installs for years.
Whenever we switch out old cast iron waste pipe for pvc through foundation I always use the Quickcrete Hydralic cement.
The stuff seals beautifully and is more of a putty consistency rather than mushy cement. You can really press it in all around the pipe.
Just keep in mind it hardens very quickly. Like 10 minutes quickly. Make sure you are all prepped and ready to slop cement before you mix it. Only do a small amount in a 5 gallon bucket at a time. The stuff is like Bondo with too much hardener. It locks up quick.
6
Home Made / New Build Pics and a Few Questions.
« on: September 08, 2013, 05:37:52 AM »
I wish I had found this great forum before starting my build but I didn't.
I've attached pics of the firebox and water jacket. Due to the vast amount of knowledge and experience many of you have, I'm sure I've done a few things wrong. This is my first build and I'm doing it from my own ideas and without a set of plans. Please go easy on me. I'm very interested in any and all feedback and criticism regarding what I've built so far. Obviously, with the work, steel and money already committed to the boiler build, radical "cut it apart and start over" suggestions aren't realistic.
I've never owned, used or seen an OWB before so I'm basically winging it. Like I said, I truly wish I had found this site before I started. But anyway...
The firebox is 1/4" hot rolled plate. It's 28" long, 24" wide and 32" tall. I've installed a 3 1/2" schedule 40 pipe under the rack for the blower to inject air under the grate. The grate is 1" round bar. My plan is to run 6" schedule 40 pipe out of the top of the firebox as the exhaust. From what I've seen on this site, I'm thinking the pipe should extend 12" or so down into the box.
The water jacket is 3/16 hot rolled plate. It is 36" wide, 48" tall and 38" long or deep looking at it from the front. I've calculated the water capacity to be 196 gallons once the firebox is installed.
I have installed a 1/2" steel bung in the bottom plate for a drain hosebib.
My questions are:
1: is it worth the extra steel and time to weld 1/4"x2" flat bar, on edge, on the outside of the fire box? The thinking being it will act as a heat sink allowing the water to come in contact with more surface area. Similar to the "fins" on an air cooled engine. I also think it may "swirl" or mix the water around the box better. I may be way off on this thinking but figured I throw it out there.
2: based on the sizes of the fire box and water jacket, how far off the bottom should the box be? I plan on installing 1" bungs for take off and return lines. I will be pulling from the bottom (of the back water jacket plate) and returning into the top. I've planned to extend 1" copper pipe into the jacket a foot or so for take off and 2 foot or so for return. I'm just not sure what you would recommend for clearance under the fire box.
3: this unit is intended to run the radiant heat in the basement and first floor, baseboards in two bedrooms up stairs and the domestic hot water for showers, faucets, etc... I'm figuring an 80-100 plate water to water heat exchanger would be sufficient.
Is the heat exchanger placed out at the boiler, in the enclosure (shed) or is it better to have it in the basement right near the existing plumbing, oil boiler, etc...? I'm planning to run 1" pex. The boiler will be almost level with the house 45 feet from the outside of the house foundation. It's approximately another 15 feet in the basement to the plumbing connections.
4: I purchased a "Honeywell 6006" aquastat with the immersion probe/well. The aquastat has a probe hard wired off the back which inserts into the immersion probe/well. Where is the best location for the probe/bung? Directly over the takeoff bung?
5: the boiler will be air fed by a blower under the grate. I was thinking of using a throttle body off a Suburu Forester to act as a baffle. The butterfly will be opened and closed with an actuator/solenoid and the blower will be attached to the throttle body "throat/rim".
When the blower shuts off and the butterfly shuts, it effectively seals off any air supply. Does the boiler require a small amount of air or draft while the boiler is "idling"?
I know the whole idea of a blower and butterfly is to kick the fire up when the water temp drops below a certain point and then to lower the fire once temprature is reached. I'm curious if an "auxiliary" vent or similar point of air intake is required to basically prevent the fire from suffocating between cycles. Is it desirable to have all air shut out between cycles?
These are the main questions I have right at the moment. As I said, I have never attempted this type of build before so I hope this will work the way I want it to.
I have many years of fabricating experience but basically no experience burning wood.
Please give me whatever you got.
Thank you very, very much!!!
[attachment deleted by admin for space issues]
I've attached pics of the firebox and water jacket. Due to the vast amount of knowledge and experience many of you have, I'm sure I've done a few things wrong. This is my first build and I'm doing it from my own ideas and without a set of plans. Please go easy on me. I'm very interested in any and all feedback and criticism regarding what I've built so far. Obviously, with the work, steel and money already committed to the boiler build, radical "cut it apart and start over" suggestions aren't realistic.
I've never owned, used or seen an OWB before so I'm basically winging it. Like I said, I truly wish I had found this site before I started. But anyway...
The firebox is 1/4" hot rolled plate. It's 28" long, 24" wide and 32" tall. I've installed a 3 1/2" schedule 40 pipe under the rack for the blower to inject air under the grate. The grate is 1" round bar. My plan is to run 6" schedule 40 pipe out of the top of the firebox as the exhaust. From what I've seen on this site, I'm thinking the pipe should extend 12" or so down into the box.
The water jacket is 3/16 hot rolled plate. It is 36" wide, 48" tall and 38" long or deep looking at it from the front. I've calculated the water capacity to be 196 gallons once the firebox is installed.
I have installed a 1/2" steel bung in the bottom plate for a drain hosebib.
My questions are:
1: is it worth the extra steel and time to weld 1/4"x2" flat bar, on edge, on the outside of the fire box? The thinking being it will act as a heat sink allowing the water to come in contact with more surface area. Similar to the "fins" on an air cooled engine. I also think it may "swirl" or mix the water around the box better. I may be way off on this thinking but figured I throw it out there.
2: based on the sizes of the fire box and water jacket, how far off the bottom should the box be? I plan on installing 1" bungs for take off and return lines. I will be pulling from the bottom (of the back water jacket plate) and returning into the top. I've planned to extend 1" copper pipe into the jacket a foot or so for take off and 2 foot or so for return. I'm just not sure what you would recommend for clearance under the fire box.
3: this unit is intended to run the radiant heat in the basement and first floor, baseboards in two bedrooms up stairs and the domestic hot water for showers, faucets, etc... I'm figuring an 80-100 plate water to water heat exchanger would be sufficient.
Is the heat exchanger placed out at the boiler, in the enclosure (shed) or is it better to have it in the basement right near the existing plumbing, oil boiler, etc...? I'm planning to run 1" pex. The boiler will be almost level with the house 45 feet from the outside of the house foundation. It's approximately another 15 feet in the basement to the plumbing connections.
4: I purchased a "Honeywell 6006" aquastat with the immersion probe/well. The aquastat has a probe hard wired off the back which inserts into the immersion probe/well. Where is the best location for the probe/bung? Directly over the takeoff bung?
5: the boiler will be air fed by a blower under the grate. I was thinking of using a throttle body off a Suburu Forester to act as a baffle. The butterfly will be opened and closed with an actuator/solenoid and the blower will be attached to the throttle body "throat/rim".
When the blower shuts off and the butterfly shuts, it effectively seals off any air supply. Does the boiler require a small amount of air or draft while the boiler is "idling"?
I know the whole idea of a blower and butterfly is to kick the fire up when the water temp drops below a certain point and then to lower the fire once temprature is reached. I'm curious if an "auxiliary" vent or similar point of air intake is required to basically prevent the fire from suffocating between cycles. Is it desirable to have all air shut out between cycles?
These are the main questions I have right at the moment. As I said, I have never attempted this type of build before so I hope this will work the way I want it to.
I have many years of fabricating experience but basically no experience burning wood.
Please give me whatever you got.
Thank you very, very much!!!
[attachment deleted by admin for space issues]
7
Home Made / Re: POR-15 the inside of water jacket.
« on: September 08, 2013, 04:35:36 AM »I'm curios about your name, where did the 420 come from
It was the "area code" in a former life. Now the only God given, natural products I burn is seasoned hardwoods and .035 E70S-6 wire and 7018 electrodes. You understand...
8
Home Made / Re: POR-15 the inside of water jacket.
« on: September 06, 2013, 05:56:42 PM »
This site is fantastic.
You have answered my question. The point regarding the boiler treatment chemicals is something I wouldn't have thought of.
Plus, if the commercial manufacturers don't do it, I'm sure it's not needed.
I've decided to forgo the paint.
Thanks!!
You have answered my question. The point regarding the boiler treatment chemicals is something I wouldn't have thought of.
Plus, if the commercial manufacturers don't do it, I'm sure it's not needed.
I've decided to forgo the paint.
Thanks!!
9
Home Made / POR-15 the inside of water jacket.
« on: September 05, 2013, 05:01:46 AM »
I've used POR-15 paint on other projects like the underside of vehicles and various outdoor steel projects.
Based on the incredible toughness and durability of POR-15, I'm curious if anyone has thought about or actually has coated the inside of their OWB water jacket with POR-15 or something similar?
I don't think heat would be an issue since the water shouldn't get any hotter than 212f due to a non pressurized system simply boils over should it reach this temp.
I'm thinking a good coating over the steel which is in contact with water would greatly reduce rust and eventual rot.
Does anyone have any expierience or general input on this idea?
Positive or negative I would love your input.
Thanks!!
Based on the incredible toughness and durability of POR-15, I'm curious if anyone has thought about or actually has coated the inside of their OWB water jacket with POR-15 or something similar?
I don't think heat would be an issue since the water shouldn't get any hotter than 212f due to a non pressurized system simply boils over should it reach this temp.
I'm thinking a good coating over the steel which is in contact with water would greatly reduce rust and eventual rot.
Does anyone have any expierience or general input on this idea?
Positive or negative I would love your input.
Thanks!!
10
Home Made / Re: Homemade "Tank-in-Tank" OWB-Ozarks Hillbilly Edition
« on: September 05, 2013, 04:53:44 AM »
Thanks for the info. I'm going to pull off the bottom and return at the top.
I appreciate the explanation.
I appreciate the explanation.
11
Home Made / Re: Homemade "Tank-in-Tank" OWB-Ozarks Hillbilly Edition
« on: September 04, 2013, 05:12:12 AM »
Hello everyone. I'm new to the site. I've been doing a lot of research around here and decided to join. I've started my own build of an OWB.
I really like the design of this burner. Especially the horizontal section of exhaust. I may do something similar on mine.
The question I have is why the hot water take off is near the bottom of the water jacket rather than the top? I'm assuming the water will be constantly circulating so its not so much a question of "heat rising" bit wouldn't you still gain a little more efficiency if the hot water take off was near the top and the return was at the bottom so the return water had to circulate up and around the firebox to head back to the house?
The reason I'm asking is because most of the home built units pull from the top and return at the bottom. I'm very interested in the reasoning for your design. I'm second guessing the planned placement of my take off and return now. You seem to have a great grasp of what you want to accomplish and would greatly appreciate any info you could provide.
THANKS!!!
I really like the design of this burner. Especially the horizontal section of exhaust. I may do something similar on mine.
The question I have is why the hot water take off is near the bottom of the water jacket rather than the top? I'm assuming the water will be constantly circulating so its not so much a question of "heat rising" bit wouldn't you still gain a little more efficiency if the hot water take off was near the top and the return was at the bottom so the return water had to circulate up and around the firebox to head back to the house?
The reason I'm asking is because most of the home built units pull from the top and return at the bottom. I'm very interested in the reasoning for your design. I'm second guessing the planned placement of my take off and return now. You seem to have a great grasp of what you want to accomplish and would greatly appreciate any info you could provide.
THANKS!!!
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