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[tlynholland]

Boy Im thinking I must be cursed or something.

I fixed my air leak problem which was causing my stove to over-heat and boil out the water. Everything has been working just fine until Thanksgiving.

Now, I have hardly any warm heat. My fan stays on my furnace all the time just trying to get my inside temperature in my house up to 70 degrees.  My stove use to run us out of the house. I live in a big log cabin that is well insulated.

Here is what I noticed: The bottom of my heat exchanger where the hot water comes in is very hot, but the radiator and the lines coming out of the top of my heat exchanger are luke warm at best.  IF I turn off my furnace fan, the top lines and radiator start getting hot again but the minute my fan turns on, it gets luke quick.  I also have NO hot water in my house without turning on my hot water heater. The exchanger to my hot water heater has the same deal - incoming lines are too hot to touch, outgoing you can lick with your bare tongue.

The head of maintenance where I work thought maybe I had a calcium buildup that plugged up my line somehow, but I have 3/4 inch copper and 3/4 inch pex lines everywhere. 
I have not put in any boiler treatment this season because I ran out from filling it up because it boiled out so often.  Would that make any difference? I cranked my stove temp up to 180 thinking that I would see if it would help, but to no avail.  I am at my wits end with this one other than starting to replace exchangers and then lines, but this is only my 3rd year with my stove running. I can't imagine that I would need to do either. I took great care with my pex lines when I installed them. I put them inside that black corrugated pipe with lots of insulation and was careful when covering them back up.  I checked my stove's water and opened up the drain valves, etc...

Any clues on any of  this beyond what I have tried??
Thanks for any advice.



 

[tlynholland]

HELP!

[Alan]

maybe you got air lock if water got to low

[willieG]

it sounds like you have no (or very little) water flow through yoru system (normally caused by one of three things)

first thing i would try is  bleeding air from the lines

second thing i would try, take a line apart in the house before any of your "appliances" and se how much water is being delivered to the house (not just see if water is coming out of the pipe) test it for 15 seconds in a measurable pail and multiply by 4, that will give you GPM and you should be at least 8 or 10 or more

if you have a good supply of water as it enters the home, do the same test after your 'appliances" if you have measurably less then you have blockage in one of your "appliances" and a cleaning or replacement is in order

good luck and please post back your findings, any knowledge you can provide from your solved problems may help others later on

[yoderheating]

You are defiantly having a water flow issue. I would bleed out any air that may be in the system. If its not an air lock you may want to check the pump. I have had a pump break some of the impellers that push water though the system. A few years ago a customer has having the same problem you are having,  the pump was running but there was very little water flow. It had me scratching my head for a while and finally I changed the pump out of desperation. It completely fixed the problem and so I looked into the pump and the impeller was almost smooth. Good luck!

[tlynholland]

How do I go about bleeding the air out of my system?  Do I drain it from my stove? or?
I can hear and feel my pump working at the back of my stove.  Should I disconnect the line there to see if it's pushing water?

[tlynholland]

Well, I do not have any air, and I have a lot of water pressure everywhere.
I drained my water heater and opened up every faucet everywhere.  Still no luck.  I have hot water coming into my house from my stove. It is getting to both exchangers (above my furnace and my hot water heater) but very little heat or hot water unless I tunr my hot water heater back on.
I would not think that it would be my pump since I have hot water to my exchangers. Other than starting to replacing my exchangers, I am out of answers or things to try.

[yoderheating]

Your house domestic water pressure will not effect the water flow from the furnace. I will guarantee you you have some kind of flow problem. The hot water is coming through the lines just not at the speed needed to keep up with demand. I can only think of three things that could cause this. 1 air in the system. How did you bleed the lines when the furnace was first installed? If you have a water feed line from your domestic water to a furnace water line you can use your domestic pressure to purge the furnace lines. 2 there is something blocking water flow. This could be something as simple as a valve that is partially closed to something as bad as calcium build up in the heat exchangers.  3 the pump impeller is broken. This will allow the pump to run but it will move very little water.
 I would start with making sure there is no valves that have been partially closed. Next I would find a way to bleed the furnace lines. If this doesn't work I would try a different pump, if that is no help the last thing would be to change heat exchangers.

[willieG]

if your pump is at the OWB take the line apart at the first "appliance" in the house and mesure how much water you are getting from the pump in the house. use a pail that is marked in gal. or litres and draw water for 15 sec. multiply  by 4 and that will give you GPM you need to be somewhere between 6 (probably work but is at teh low end) and 10 (this would deliver about 100,000 btu per hour with a 20 degree drop in the return water (i think most of us run a lot less than 20 degree drop)

that is the first thing i would check, if you don't have good delivery then i would follow the advice of yonder and try a new pump. Unless you have a chunk of something come loose from your stove or you got a chunk of gravel in teh pipes when you installed them i would not think you ahve a calcium build up in the lines (maybe in an exchanger) my lines were in teh ground ten years and they were still delivering plenty of GPM

first thing you need to do is confirm water delivery

[tlynholland]

The lines from my stove first go to my exchanger for my water heater, and then to my exchanger/plenum that sits on top my furnace fan.

All of my valves are open completely.

I'm going to disconnect the water/pex line just prior to my exchange the feeds my hot water heater and then goes over to my furnace in a series,

I have hot water to one side of the first exchanger and then hot water over to my exchanger/plenum, but I have NO hot water on my exchanger on the side where it goes to feed my hot water heater, and I have no hot water on the top of my exchanger/plenum which then returns BACK to my stove.

IF I turn off my furnace (fan) the top of the exchanger/plenum will then start getting HOT, but the minute I turn the furnace fan back on, it get luke to the touch quickly.
That should tell me something but I'm not stove smart enough to know what exactly.


Thanks for all the suggestions and input.  My house will heat to about 65 degrees MAX and it does not seem like I am going through the wood like I normally do at all. This also should tell me something, but again, I don't know what.

[Dirtslinger]

Sounds like the pump is getting weak what pump  do you have?

[yoderheating]

 The reason your heat exchanger is hot on the supply side but not the return side is because the water is moving through it so slowly the air moving through your blower is able to pull all the heat off of it.  The reason your stove isn't taking as much wood is because the heat isn't traveling to your house.
 If it was me I would throw another pump on it. Pumps are cheap and easy to change.

[willieG]

i agree with yonder and all others who suspect the pump (that is the first thing to check anyway) if you dont want to try a new pump, check the one you have. take the line apart at your  first "appliance" and check water flow (at least 6 GPM and hopefully 10 or better)  if you havent got good flow, suspect pump and try a new one

[rosewood]

i agree with the others your pump is junk! it is most likely moving a small amount of water to your exchanger, then when fan turns on it robs all the heat from it cause pump cant provide enough volumn to it. sometimes when pumps are off for a while they can sease up from water quality. if you go to  buy one, go to plummers supply an ask , tell them the size of pipe and lenght,size and make of heat exchangers       chances are your original pump was size right.

[tlynholland]

ALL - I took off the top connection to the heat exchanger where my line comes in from my stove.  Once I got it completely disconnected (not just loose) Hot water shot out of it.  I pushed it back on and tightened it back up and then noticed ALL of the white calcium chunks and bits all over my wall from where the water had shot out.

I think that tomorrow when I get home from work I am going to try take off the connections to my heat exchangers and try cleaning them all out the best that I can.  I'm wondering if I should try blasting air from a compressor thru my exchangers to try and clean them out?

I will see if thei helps or works, and if not then I will be buying a new pump.  I can't imagine that a pump that is only 2 & 1/2 years old would be out already, but maybe so.  It seems like a very nice industrial grade pump and I can hear it running.  Could I have damaged it from when my stove was over-heating?

Life is full of lessons and most seem to come from experiences.  Unforunately the timing (it's frigging freezing here) and expense (it's also Christmas time) is kicking me in the butt! I bought the stove to save a lot of money but I figure it will take 7 years before I break even IF things worked. With all this extra troublem this stove has not been worth it to me, but maybe my experience or luck is the exception.
HOW in the world do people live OFF the grid?  It seems like ALL very hard work to me!