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[tulenutn2o]

Seems that Shaver may have been fudging? see:http://r20.rs6.net/tn.jsp?llr=viweaniab&et=1109252550607&s=22144&e=001Aolzl4VTrC3yXa6u3hxWhlVwCHxLUl_GzPzhIGZIe-bP_hjhcld9OjQi8_rxp7epcFFD0ohg_KcZQEKUxZ5Fb6gK1ECQtGrzv3CR4S65CY5XBiEjG5mgS1wPzrWpdVQJh0B4SQXbu0jdEZcvA196nkXDk7EEGf47ltc0BjHDe2Bibgk1tGheop4W7d2_TMyHe4ME9LVyheBIeYSLU25lJ9E07l97oBzF_rtZuPTnfOrRFPyp71lyshsNRqRQm0FswpFkthkaAA7bj3V-7ng1gA==     

[Scott7m]

I can't get the link to work but i can't imagine them ever actually testing them.

[tinner]

Try this. http://www.irs.gov/irb/2011-48_IRB/ar16.html?utm_source=HEAT+Feb+2010+Issue+36&utm_campaign=HEAT+2-18-12&utm_medium=email

[Scott7m]

It looks like all the griping the legitimate companies did finally did a bit of good. 

[RSI]

It looks like all the griping the legitimate companies did finally did a bit of good.

All the legitimate companies might as well have done the same thing if all they do is tell them to stop giving out the certificates.

[brink1963]

How is the efficiency of an OWB measured? I have a Shaver 165 and I have burned for the most part dead tree timber (already fallen) since October. I heat a two story home with two heat exchangers plus DHW.  My total cost out of pocket for the wood I burned would be less then $200. I will probably save over $2000 by not buying propane this winter. I am happy with that.

[TheBoiler]

The EPA are revamping the test.

[Scott7m]

You didn't have to have an EPA test done, it could be done by anyone from what I can gather , that's how they got away with it.  But RSI is right, everyone should have if they just ask em to stop.  Shoulda had to refund the tax payers

I did some numbers under central boilers section on ridge kids stove if you want to see hoe to calculate efficiceny on your unit at home.  His cb 5036 was about 48% efficient, right in line with most conventional boilers.  I have checked a couple hardys and they have been in the upper 30's.  The heatmaster e series and portage and main double pass conventionals probably are in the 60-65% range based oN what checking ive done

[lugnut]

Okay,

In "layman's"  terms what in the hell does all of this mean?  Explanation please "without" bashing the Shaver product.  We Shaver owners have to always put up with that kind of talk, so just lay it out plain and simple for me.  Thank you kindly.

Lugnut

[Scott7m]

Plain and simple..

They ripped off every tax payer in the country for there own gain.  Claiming ther stoves were 75% efficient to qualify for the tax credit.  They knew all along they weren't even close to those kind of numbers.  However they wanted there piece of the pie and didn't want to develop a stove that could actually do that. 

So, they mid led every customer, the IRS, and every tax payer to line there wallets. 

It's fraud at it's most common sense, what I meant by legitimate companies, was the ones who actually spent 100k dollars developing a stove to make 75%, they griped enough to get it to stop.  Shaver wasn't the only one doing that, but they were the most forceful and misleading through there claims.  Across the industry shaver is hated by most manufacturers because they feel they give the whole industry a bad name through activities such as this one. 

That's as simple as I can put it, no personal opinions involved

[powerstroke]

In all honesty, we should ALL get tax credits for burning 100% renewable energy to heat our homes!  I could see getting a tax credit for a high efficiency gas or electric furnace because you are using less fossil fuel but we aren't burning ANY (except the tiny amount for fans and pumps).  If they are really concerned about the environment they should bend over bacwards for people like us!  I believe though that is not really the case......     

[tulenutn2o]

Thanks Tinner, for getting a hyperlink on here that worked.

[jimr]

just looks like just another mud slinging episode to me.

[Scott7m]

just looks like just another mud slinging episode to me.

The IRS makes the info available and you expect people to be happy they acted in such an unprofessional manner?

[beeman]

what i have learned from this site is most on this site dont whant enything from the gov we are looking for the freedom from them  and strive to be self reliant and at least my gole is to go off the grid,  but back to the tax that iam not smart enough to do my self   H&R block was going to give me a creidt for my  homemade dog if i only could find out how to be tax free