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[Roger2561]

Holy smokes. This is why I would never want a wood only boiler.
12-20 cords a season!!!
Houses are way too big these days. I grew up in a farm house. We heated with wood and coal. Most houses were 1200-1500sqft. With two in the house stoves, we heated and cooked with 2.5 Ton a winter and 2 cords for 5 people.
My house is 4400 sqft in Ohio. Well insulated, heating water too. Setting 180/12 diff, draft 75% open, house at 72F.
I have a NCB 250 Coal.
If I use wood only, I will burn through 1 cord even 2 weeks, and can't get over 10-14 hrs between loads. Probably lest time, more like 8-10 hrs when it's cold out. My friend has a CB she gets the same results for a very similar house.
I much much much prefer burning coal vs wood. A lot less smoke and the burn time is at least doubled. Also, no cresol build up. In spite what you hear, it's a lot cleaner way of heating. Not to mention, all the incredible amount of labor that goes into cutting, splitting, stacking, drying, moving wood. My back hurts just thinking about it.

So, I predominantly burn coal. So, for coal I change the setting to 172/5 diff, 75% draft, house 72F.
I burn through 1 Ton in 6 weeks and add 1/4-1/3 cord of wood.
So, I will use 1.5-2 cords of wood, and 4.5 Ton at that rate.
So, I'm a math person and let's check this.

Here are my calculations;


1ga prpane = 91,502 BTU
Anthrocite coal 1lb=15,000BTU bruns at 900F

We use 825-1000ga propane per 1 yr. Now, that is if we keep the house at 67F-68F at most.
If I turn up the house to 72F with propane, we use 1800-2000+ ga or more.

So,
825ga prop=75,489,250BTU/year

825ga prop = 5032lb anth coal=2.5Ton
But that is assuming that your stove/boiler is 100% efficient.
boilers are 35-50%, so lets adjust for that. Let's say 40% efficient, and loosing 60%

??Ton coal=2.5Ton with 60% loss of energy (40% efficiency)
??Ton coal=XTon-0.6 (60%) X ton=2.5Ton
??X Ton=0.4 XTon=2.5Ton

??X = 6.25 Ton needed for a season.

Now, the propane also heats the cooking stove, so we need to subtract some for that.

So, I should use 5.5 Ton a season.

I currently use 1 Ton every 5-6 weeks, which should equal to about 5-6 Ton a season.
So the math matches perfect.

By switching the breaker off to the 80ga water heater we are saving about $80 / per month. $500 a season.
Propane $2500-$3000 a season. More like $5500-$6000 if the house would be at 72F.
Total cost=$3500+ a season at 67F. or $5500-$6000 at 72F
My Coal cost; $500-$700 a season.

So, save about $3000 but keep the house 72-74F instead of 68F.
Technically we are saving more like $5500+ because if we kept the house at 72F with propane it would cost way more to heat with propane.


1ga prop=6.1lb anth coal=91,502 BTU
1lb anth coal=0.16ga prop = 15,000 BTU

ati53 - Welcome to the forum.  Happy New Year! 

Believe it not, some of us actually enjoy physical labor (sweat equity); i.e.cutting, splitting, stacking, hauling, etc.. of fire wood.  After splitting wood all day, I feel the same physically as I do after a long run; energized!  Before I purchased the outdoor wood boiler, I heated my home and domestic hot-water with fuel oil.  It was costing me $5100.00/yr with the thermostats set at 68 degrees in my house.  That $5100.00 I used to spend for oil now buys a whole lot of firewood log length.  The guy from whom I purchase the logs guarantees an 11 cord load at $100/cord.  After the cutting, splitting and stacking (on half cord pallets and moved by tractor to area to dry.  The pallets are never unloaded) that load of logs yielded a 13 1/2 cord load.  I have 2 seasons worth of fire wood out of that load.  I now have my thermostats set 70 degrees 24/7.  Any warmer than that I find it too warm.  It's uncomfortable for me. 

The last time I checked to get coal delivered in bulk was $325/ton.  Or, I could have had it delivered in bags on 1 ton pallets at a cost of $375/ton.  Believe me, if it hadn't cost so much for the coal I would have gone that route.  In Ohio, do you have easy access to coal?  I believe if I wanted coal in bulk it would have come from a company in Maine.  I live in NH in a town bordering VT.

Thanks for the numbers.  It was an interesting read.  Roger   

[BoilerHouse]

When relating our wood consumption, I don't think we are always compaing apples to apples.  Some members, like myself, are stating use in full cords  (wood piled 4x4x8 feet).  Some are using face cords (1/3 of a full cord).   

[woodedacres]

Happy new year!!!
We are about to have 1F weather.
please advise where you get anthracite for 105 to 120 a ton. i want in on that
I pay $105-120 for anthracite ("special arrangement") picked up, and $220 delivered / ton. The best!!! No smoke, no smell.
I don't like it bagged because it's too much trouble ripping the bags open, and I have to waste all the plastic. It seems to be really wet too. Bagged is $300-330/ton
We have a mine in Ohio, they sell bit coal for $75 a Ton, ok quality (bad smoke, bad smell. KY coal is $140-$180 where i work, good quality.
So, it's cheaper here by a lot.
I enjoy splitting wood too, but 12-15 cords is a lot. Especially thinking when I get older, I may not want all that work. Right now wood is very easily available due to the ash borer. It's not always the case. A lot of people are switching to wood heat. Once the ash trees are gone, we will have a lot less available. At least in Ohio. Here, it's hard to get a reliable source if you want to buy wood.
I tried for months.
In Ohio it's against the law to transport some wood, from some county to another, which makes it even more difficult in some counties with limited wooded areas.
I collected 30 cords just my self this summer, from people who didn't want their trees. Took probably 1 week total. Not bad, for saving $5500+. Just a lot of work.
With coal, I save $4500+ vs $5500 with coal, but 90% less labor.
My boiler NCB250, can't ever, no matter what I do, go more than 10hrs-12hrs per load on wood alone. So I have to rush out to load it first thing in the morning. Lot of other people seem to have the similar experience with wood boilers of different kind.
I like how I can go from 8pm to next day 8pm-10pm (24 hrs-28hrs) with one load of coal. No need to rush out in the morning.
May be some other boilers are better. Our friends have CB, and some others and they get about 12hrs. I know, there are so many other factors, soft , etc.
May be I should have bought a CB. They just don't make a coal unit. 
I don't really understand why propane is so expensive anyway, they are franking our entire state for gas. You would think it would be close to free. Since 2003, propane price 5x.
 
Have a great New Year.
 

ati53 - Welcome to the forum.  Happy New Year! 

Believe it not, some of us actually enjoy physical labor (sweat equity); i.e.cutting, splitting, stacking, hauling, etc.. of fire wood.  After splitting wood all day, I feel the same physically as I do after a long run; energized!  Before I purchased the outdoor wood boiler, I heated my home and domestic hot-water with fuel oil.  It was costing me $5100.00/yr with the thermostats set at 68 degrees in my house.  That $5100.00 I used to spend for oil now buys a whole lot of firewood log length.  The guy from whom I purchase the logs guarantees an 11 cord load at $100/cord.  After the cutting, splitting and stacking (on half cord pallets and moved by tractor to area to dry.  The pallets are never unloaded) that load of logs yielded a 13 1/2 cord load.  I have 2 seasons worth of fire wood out of that load.  I now have my thermostats set 70 degrees 24/7.  Any warmer than that I find it too warm.  It's uncomfortable for me. 

The last time I checked to get coal delivered in bulk was $325/ton.  Or, I could have had it delivered in bags on 1 ton pallets at a cost of $375/ton.  Believe me, if it hadn't cost so much for the coal I would have gone that route.  In Ohio, do you have easy access to coal?  I believe if I wanted coal in bulk it would have come from a company in Maine.  I live in NH in a town bordering VT.

Thanks for the numbers.  It was an interesting read.  Roger   
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[ecc_33]

a lot of places in southern ohio. New lex ohio has a mine that sells it also.

[slimjim]

I would also like to dispute a couple of numbers, first I can tell you that the mills around here pay on hardwood at 5400 pounds per cord second where are you getting the efficiency numbers on wood boilers, smoke dragons may be 30% efficient but todays gassers are in the 80+% efficient range and certainly burn cleaner than your coal boiler, how about this you stick your head in the stack of your coal burner and I will stick mine in my gasser and see which of us stands longer, ever think of the enviromental aspects of coal verses wood and what about the renewable part,and lastly how about the FACT that wood is a ZERO carbon fuel meaning that it adds ZERO carbon to our enviroment

[wissel12]

Which Oxford mine plant do you get it from?  I seen a couple when trying to look it up.

[slimjim]

Hey anti 53, you may know some things about coal but that don't mean you are Einstien when it comes to wood, I don't claim to be either but heres a few facts, first the 80% + efficiency  rating that most gassers have is from your EPA certified lab, ours was done at Intertech in Middletown Wisconsin where it's pretty much impossible to buy the results, where your coal plants are typically done on site where who knows maybe nobody is watching what gets slipped into the pocket of the onsite inspector, next you say that there are no wood fired power plants, you guys in the coal world might want to watch closely because Bio Mass power plants are popping up all over the Northeast, By the way Einstien Maine is spelled with an E on the end. Yes coal is decomposed wood ( that the carbons from it have been safely stored for millions of years and now we dig them up and burn them adding to the carbon in our atmosphere, whereas with wood we are actually taking the worlds filter ( a tree ) and burning it hotter and cleaner than ever before, technology has come a long way in the past 10 years, you might want to update yourself a bit. I'm not telling anybody to not burn coal but I certainly am not for digging up coal, trucking it to the northeast and then breathing its emissions when here in MAINE we have more forest than any other state in these continental United States. I'm wondering something , Do you have some sort of agenda? Why would you come on a wood boiler forum and tell us how ignorant we are for doing what works for us? If you think we are all so stupid why don't you just say Good-Bye and start a coal burning forum of your own? I'm sure you would do really well !  HOWS THEM CARBON CREDITS WORKIN OUT FOR YA.

[slimjim]

One more scientific question for you Einstien, HOWS THEM CARBON CREDITS WORKIN FOR YA!!!!!!!!!!

[hondaracer2oo4]

GOOD-NESS, must be to much holiday juice going around. My 2 cents on coal, when I bought my current house I was trying figure out what was the most economical way for me to heat. My previous house I heated with a Reading Leigha Coal Stoker stove. I liked it alot, I heated the whole house with it and went through 3.5 tons per year. I heated only about 1200 sqft though. I was getting bagged anthracite rice coal for around $300 a ton. That means it cost me about $1000 per winter to heat. Not bad at all. Well when I bought my new house the property has 10 acres and no close neighbors. I was deciding between a Coal Stoker Boiler like an EFM or Axeman Anderson or a OWB. Well I came across my Hardy for $500 bucks and couldn't say no to the price. I realized that you can always find wood for free but you can never get coal for free. I also buy firewood by the log length for $100 per cord. That is way cheaper than I can get coal per ton. I go through 12 cords of wood per winter which is $1200. I would never be able to heat the house on 4 tons of coal in a Stoker Boiler. Realistically it would be around 6-8 or so tons most likely. My good friend has a Keystocker coal boiler and goes through about 7.

[slimjim]

Thanks Honda, I've been out in the cold most of the day and really don't need the foolishness from this guy, let him burn his coal, just don't tell me that I should be doing the same or he's gonna call me a nitwit, to each his own and run what ya brung.

[hondaracer2oo4]

Amen

[merrellroofing]

I'm with Honda but I haven't had to buy any wood.  I hauled 25000 pounds of wood home in the last two days on $50 in gas. So at this point, I don't care how much wood it burns.

[willieG]

i have ct wood for a long time...i had an indoor wood furnace and burnt about 8 cords a year...i now have a home made OWB and still burn 8 to 10 cords a year (between furnaces i added on to the house and insulate a lot better) yes my home made is not very efficient but i can tell you this...cutting wood in the bush with my 2 sons (and on occasion the wife is along as well) as they grew up sure brought us a lot closer together as a family as  dialing up some  business to delver me coal. yes it is work..and as long as you stay a head it is enjoyable work (at lest for me) my youngest son is 28 and still in university and when he comes home for christmas his first words are..we cutting wood dad, i hope so.  it actually makes me feel good to see this young man who will soon be a professional engineer and PHD still has the desire to get out there and do some physical work. i like to think that all those years cutting in the woods as a family had something to do with not only help to set his goals but also instilled in him that working hard at what ever you do will make you succelssful...even cutting wood can bring you satisification. we try and burn on  deal elm and ash as these trees in my area die faster than  i can keep up with them. we also plant trees every year as we like to think we are good stewards of the land. i will agree that wood burning with an OWB is not for everyone and everyone has their opinion. i would be the first person to tell a newbie searching out wood stoves that they should think long and hard about one as they are a big responsability. i will agree 5 cords for a winter here in ontario is a bit hard for me to swallow but i dont own a gasser so i could never call "bullcrap" as i don't have the "on hand" proof of yes or no.

[Brad]

Right on willie!  I'm fairly new to the wood cutting owb scene as I have lived in the city up until two years ago. I have three young boys and I hope to enjoy what you do with your sons. Mine are not able to help a whole lot right now but they are with me at times and when their not they know what I'm doing. I have all the trees and woods to last for generations and each spring we will be out planting new ones as we have done for two years now. I want them to understand why we do what we do and it's so much larger than just how many cords we burn (burn a lot living in northern mn in a old drafty poorly insulated farm house). I enjoy doing  this and it keeps me in shape and I gotta think I'm adding to my quality and if it keeps me on this planet a little longer to see my boys grow that's all I can ask. I know this is kind of changing the way the thread but I think in this case that ain't a bad thing. I would like to think we are all here to learn something which I do every day. The regular guys on here have taught me a ton and I appreciate that.   

[willieG]

i understand coal is cheap (i guess) if you are near it..when i was a kid everyone used coal where i live. now, no one burns coal as it is no longer cheap to get here. gas is the best choice for home heating by far in my area.. i dont have a gas line on my road (one of the las ones not to have it)  in my area of ontario canada it is said (by our government agency  of some sort) that an average ontario home (what ever that is) requires 100,000,000 btu for an average ontario winter. if we said that a cord of mixed hardwood maybe had 20,000,000 recoverable btu in it that would mean  if your stove was 100 percent efficent you would require 5 cords (we know that aint true)  now i know i burn around 8 to 10 cords so that (i think) puts my old home made at about 50 or 60 percent efficient (if my home is average?) it is a century home (brick) with a full basement 2000 sqft, first floor and second floor,1800 sqft,  all heated  i have rebuilt about every room and filled the walls with spray foam insulation so i know that is good, have a foot (or more) of batts and blown in, in the attic and mostly new windows (a couple of moe to go) my OWB sits too far frm my house but it is well out of the way at 250 feet (underground lines lose a little heat at that distance)