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[boss302]

What is the scoop on the newly released Ultimizer series from P&M?

[caprice_96]

I am interested on expert opinions on this stove too.  It is one I am seriously considering. 

Are P&M's claims true about how much less wood they use comparted to other conventional stoves? 

[Scott7m]

Does the p and m use less wood than other models?  Sometimes yea, just depends on what your comparing it to, the regular p and m line is the same as heatmasters e series, they are a bit more efficient than the basic designed stoves yea

For the most part, all efficiency numbers are bogus and only attainable in lab situations where there burning crib wood and not even burning real firewood, it's all marketing!  Just like empyre or central for example with stoves reaching 90% efficiency, stack temps are still over 300, regardless of what u read, they are over 300 and often over 400, me and others have checked this numerous times.  So if ur stack temp is 400, and your operating at 90% efficient that would mean your internal temps would need to be 3000 degrees or better, not happening, I know what the advertisements say, my office is filled with them, but I can't say the companies are lying, because in that lab, they can probably tweak things to get such crazy numbers, but to ever expect anything remotely close to that in the real world is crazy

As far as the new p and m design, I like the idea, but as with every other new design, it's going to have unforeseen issues and stuff that will be phased out over time, but I do like the principle of it

[dakotaman]

I am trying to find out more about the BL28-40 from an owner. However, I am not sure when they first went into production and whether they have been tested by an owner for a winter.

I currently own a Central Boiler CL-17 that sprung a leak this past winter for the first time in 20 years. Although I have considered buying another CB, I have a couple of friends who have had serious problems with water leaking from the welds --- their stoves are less than 5 years old. I don't believe that many of the new non-gasification brands have improved in terms of design or burn efficiency.

For a conventional boiler, the BL28-40 seems like the more efficient design among the stoves I have researched. I live in Canada, and toured the P&M factory in Piney, Manitoba last spring. I was impressed with the overall quality of their stoves, particularly this model.

[slimjim]

I know a bit about the B-L line and the PM line as I not only sell and install them but also do some R and D on the road for them, what I can tell you is that is a brand new product that I really like, here are some of the things that appeal to me as a tech. First it is the same basic stove as the M-L line with major upgrades. The massive amount of refractory and brick in the unit helps a great deal in burning more of the smoke than the M-L, keeping more energy in the fire pot is key to efficiancy and that is the idea of the bricks, next thing I like is that it is a sectional boiler, meaning that it can be seperated into two pieces giving much better access to the inside of the unit in case it ever needs to be patched. I KNOW why would any boiler manufacturer admit that their boiler is going to rot out, I'm telling you they all eventually will rot out, there are things that the cunsumer can do to prolong the life of the boilers like doing their water samples, cleaning ash out, covering the stack, all common sense stuff but most people shut their unit down and forget it till fall, They will clean it next weekend and next weekend never comes, what the B-L line has done is to enable the unit to be welded very easily on site, there is no place on it that you can't reach by taking it apart, every boiler will eventually fail this just allows more in service years, by then if we have done our job correctly, that customer will come back to us. Don't be afraid to try it, if anyone knows how P-M works with new products and warranty claims I guess I do.

[dakotaman]

Thanks for the reply. Can you tell me if P&M requires that the use of glycol in their boilers. I have done some research and it is quite expensive.

[slimjim]

Sorry for the delayed response. no we do not require anything other than the use of boiler treatment, it is a good idea to set the unit up so as to be easily drained and the lines blown out though as your plans may change in the middle of the winter and need to leave the boiler unattended.

[Muskoka98]

Have on one order should be here by end of month.  Friend also bought one to replace 14 year old Wood Doctor which has been repaired a few times.  Will let you know how it works out.

[slimjim]

Thank you both and if you need anything including advice please let me know.

[dakotaman]

I have decided to purchase one also and hope to have it shipped in the next few weeks. I will keep people posted as to how it performs. I'm sure I will have more questions. Thanks. 

[slimjim]

Please do, when it comes to the install, if you have any questions please post them as it may help others as well, the more questions we answer now the better as I see a very busy season coming up. Crude oil opened at 107 per barrel this morning up from I think 86 dollars only 6 weeks ago, something is up !

[Scott7m]

Slim, always shocks me seeing oil prices being talked about in relation to heating cost.  Probably less that 1% of all homes in my region heat with heating oil.  Nearly everyone here is on heat pumps, propane, or geothermal

[coolidge]

I see that gas is going up at a steady pace also.
   scott:  I think the average for Maine is like 87% use oil, although i have seen alot of people switching to propane.
Actually my wife wants me to go back to oil so i dont have to process the wood thats FREE

[Scott7m]

Buddy what's she want you to do?  Just sit there and wait for your final days?

Heck with that, being more independent and less dependent on other folks is what it's all about

[slimjim]

Hey coolidge, I've been meaning to call you, I have some new door gasket material that is silicone coated that seems to be much better for air leaks. Why don't you come on up to the Waterford worlds fair this weekend, I'll be there and will bring some with me.