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16
Global Hydronics / Re: Hawken Energy/Global Hydronics
« on: February 17, 2009, 01:58:18 PM »
Check out my posts too!
Leaky
Leaky
17
Global Hydronics / Re: Is it Wood Doctor or is it Global Hydronics - Which is it?
« on: February 17, 2009, 01:56:24 PM »
I don't think it would help any!
How many rotting Global furnaces do you suppose are out there under other brand names?
How many dealers have devorces themselves of Global and tried to make there own product?
Customers are being left "out in the cold"!
It's not a pretty picture!
Leaky
How many rotting Global furnaces do you suppose are out there under other brand names?
How many dealers have devorces themselves of Global and tried to make there own product?
Customers are being left "out in the cold"!
It's not a pretty picture!
Leaky
18
Hawken Energy, support only / Re: Buyer beware
« on: February 17, 2009, 01:38:30 PM »
Hawken sold Global Hydronics furnaces for years. Customers bought the furnaces under the auspice that Hawken manufactured them.
I was never given any reason to believe otherwise. Now because of some stinkeye hissy fit between Hawken and Global, Hawken decided to try to make their own.
these HE1100 furnaces are little more than a burn barrel surrounded by water. To say that I am impatient is an insult. I paid good money for the original furnace.
I paid the extra cash for stainless, and something that at least looked good. These new furnaces look like some soft headed mouth breather had one too manu hands in the design work.
OK . . . . Ouch! Ouch! . . . . This is where I am at too . . . Wood Doctor seems to have walked away from any kind of client service obligations relating to their products manufactured by Global Hydronics and sold as a 100% Wood Doctor furnace!! How was I supposed to know! It's like, "Talk to the Hand", you know!
Here's the thing, Ouch! When they replaced my leaking Wood Doctor they brought me another Global Hydronics which rotted through, just like the first! But it doesn't look like there going to bring another one and I wouldn't want it if they did!
I expect this spring I will have to drag the poor pathetic leaking Wood Doctor up road-side and post a very very large sign on it, "For Sale $8 500 - One Rotting Leaking Wood Furnace Sold to me by Wood Doctor!"
What is this chatter I have heard about a class action suite against Global Hydronics . . . is there any truth to it? There wouldn't be any class action suits against Wood Doctor in the works would there. I would sure like to know about that, if there was!
Leaky
PS - sorry, no time to check spelling or grammer!
19
Fire Wood / Re: wood drying time
« on: February 17, 2009, 12:46:08 PM »I went on ebay and bought a cheap moisture meter just to toy around with it'll only go up to 40 percent but anything higher needs way more dry time, interesting to see what trees that have been down a while register.
I'm gonna have a look at getting one so I can get a better idea just what I'm burning! I would like to burn less wood, so I was checking out that Wood Doctor Wood Converter (the boiler plate model of course . . . no more Stainless Steel for me!)!
Man! You don't know what to think? . . . . they tell you it burns 50% less wood ... then a little later on they say it only burns seasoned wood!
Well, if you can only burn seasoned wood, wouldn't you be burning 50% less wood!! Oh Man??
Leaky
20
Global Hydronics / Re: Is it Wood Doctor or is it Global Hydronics - Which is it?
« on: February 16, 2009, 11:19:05 AM »
It took a long time for my water saturated insulation to drip dry!
Leaky
Leaky
21
Global Hydronics / Re: Is it Wood Doctor or is it Global Hydronics - Which is it?
« on: February 16, 2009, 11:15:06 AM »
Those beautiful pine plugs saved the day!
Leaky
Leaky
22
Global Hydronics / Re: Is it Wood Doctor or is it Global Hydronics - Which is it?
« on: February 16, 2009, 11:13:44 AM »
Here's a look at those pine plugs and boiler water jetting out of the bottom of my first Wood Doctor!
Leaky
Leaky
23
Global Hydronics / Re: Is it Wood Doctor or is it Global Hydronics - Which is it?
« on: February 16, 2009, 11:11:41 AM »
I believe Global Hydronics is insisting my warranty is with Wood Doctor, not with them!
Here is the only picture I've been able to find so far which reminds me that I did indeed purchase a fully logo-ed Wood Doctor furnace. See that light grey paneling in the picture of those buckets catching the boiler water leaking out of my furnace in only it's second heating season!!
I have my relatives checking all their photos to see if I can come up with a better picture of that original Wood Doctor I purchased. This picture was taken when I used to use pine plugs to stop the leaks. Pine plugs don't work so well on cracks in the welds though! On my second furnace I have had to resort to epoxy putty to keep the water in!
I'll post some more pictures of my adventures in pine plugging here as well!
Leaky
Here is the only picture I've been able to find so far which reminds me that I did indeed purchase a fully logo-ed Wood Doctor furnace. See that light grey paneling in the picture of those buckets catching the boiler water leaking out of my furnace in only it's second heating season!!
I have my relatives checking all their photos to see if I can come up with a better picture of that original Wood Doctor I purchased. This picture was taken when I used to use pine plugs to stop the leaks. Pine plugs don't work so well on cracks in the welds though! On my second furnace I have had to resort to epoxy putty to keep the water in!
I'll post some more pictures of my adventures in pine plugging here as well!
Leaky
24
Hawken Energy, support only / Re: Hawken Energy Owner
« on: February 12, 2009, 01:52:44 PM »I originally purchassed a GH built hawken two years ago. unfortunately last september I noticed some leaks in the back of the stove. getting the warranty honored was a nightmare, and took nearly 3 months. I was installing this new hawken 1100 in December. the two stoves are definately not interchangeable. the 1100 burns way too much wood, and the door leaks a black juice that builds up into icicles. I have contacted my dealer, and Dave at hawken about these issues. I have also gotten in touch with another dissatisfied owner of an 100 just a few miles away. he has to load the stove 3 times a day. I found a design flaw with these stoves, and found a way to reduce the consumption considerably. I am very discouraged by the lack of customer service offered by Hawken, and poor crafstmanship in the furnace. they claim to have cut out the middleman (global Hydronics) to save the customer money. They are selling inferior products and ignoring their customers.
oh, don't be supprised when the armor flex seal tight conduit breaks by the door, everyone I spoke to has this issue.
to make a long story short, don't waste your money on a Hawken.
So, how much did it cost you to get your warranty honnored??
Leaky
Ouch!
25
Wood Doctor / Re: Anyone have a Wood Doctor?
« on: February 12, 2009, 01:38:34 PM »
Well!
Who agrees that a 2000 lbs furnace physically connected to one's operational heating system should not be interpreted as "a part" that a dealer can request I throw on a truck and ship anywhere?
Sure, I'll ship a fan, thermostat, switch or something, but the entire boiler???
My warranty states "part or parts thereof", not every last stinking part all in one shipment!
This is just some kind of warranty game being played at the client's expense!
If you ask me, it's nothing more than a ... ... wording interpretation!
Could your dealer play this game with you? Would he?
I would appreciate some comments on this!
Thanks,
Leaky
Who agrees that a 2000 lbs furnace physically connected to one's operational heating system should not be interpreted as "a part" that a dealer can request I throw on a truck and ship anywhere?
Sure, I'll ship a fan, thermostat, switch or something, but the entire boiler???
My warranty states "part or parts thereof", not every last stinking part all in one shipment!
This is just some kind of warranty game being played at the client's expense!
If you ask me, it's nothing more than a ... ... wording interpretation!
Could your dealer play this game with you? Would he?
I would appreciate some comments on this!
Thanks,
Leaky
26
Wood Doctor / Re: Wood Doctor Warranty!
« on: February 12, 2009, 01:20:12 PM »
Wow!
No responses to this one!
somebody say something!
Leaky
No responses to this one!
somebody say something!
Leaky
27
Wood Doctor / Re: Patching those holes in my Wood Doctor!
« on: February 12, 2009, 01:14:45 PM »
Oh My!
I knew I wasn't dreaming! I knew I wasn't alone!
Sorry to hear about your troubles . . . nice picture though!
I thought I was looking at my furnace!
Put something up on Hearth.com too! Spread the word!
Later,
Leaky
I knew I wasn't dreaming! I knew I wasn't alone!
Sorry to hear about your troubles . . . nice picture though!
I thought I was looking at my furnace!
Put something up on Hearth.com too! Spread the word!
Later,
Leaky
28
Plumbing / Re: Corrosion Problems!
« on: February 11, 2009, 02:12:24 PM »
I'm going to post up what Wood Doctor advises for boiler treatment!
What they were asvising before I had two of their stainless boilers corrode through on me!
And what they're advising now!
But before I do that ....
Eyes Wide Open!
Here is an very interesting blurb I just received from a friend!!
Can't say I know for sure if it is all correct, but it sure sounds feasible to me!!
How Wood Doctor can just sell customers an OWB and then just leave them in the dark about all this stuff, I do not know???
Well hey, they are the ones warrantying the durability of their products against corrosion among other things, so they're actually the ones on the hook to fix these leaking beast, or so you would think!!
My friend says the following in regard to my . . .
"Corroded Leaking FULLY WARRANTIED Heavy Gauge Stainless Steel WOOD DOCTOR Furnace"
*****************
I would venture to suggest, that they may be using 406 stainless as it welds up good with normal steel panels. However, it also has the characteristic of creating galvanic cells within itself if it lays submerged in still brackish water (freshwater with higher then normal chloride levels).
Are you leaving your system full in the summer when not in use and have you tested water for chloride levels (salt). It could be that you are using system in the summer too, but you are not getting enough demand to keep water circulating enough. Whatever the case, it could be that there are pockets of still brackish water forming galvanic cells next to the stainless!
Unless you are regularly blowing down (draining boiler bottom liquid/sludge out under pressure) and topping up with new water you will over time have chloride build up to dangerous levels (levels high enough that the boiler water becomes an electrolyte and allows galvanic cells to form). Then away goes the iron in your stainless steel alloy and oops there is a hole. This will occur mostly near the bottom of your boiler where salt concentrations will be highest!
Monitoring PH levels is good, but PH only helps reduce corrosion by keeping water slightly alkaline. Unfortunately, even alkaline water becomes an electrolyte if chloride (salt) PPM get high enough.
Desired level of chlorides should be around 15-25 PPM, but practically you would probably have difficulty keeping it between 50-75 PPM.
You need to test water with silver nitrate chloride test kit to get PPM. You will likely find that you will need to start draining water regularly to keep chloride levels down. You are shooting yourself in the foot by running the same old soup in system forever, or in this case until it cuts it's own drain holes and runs out on the ground.
In these open systems, boiler water will only continue to build in chloride content as pure water is boiled off (concentrating the soup) and then new water containing even minute levels of salts is added! That is why boiler water neutrality is controlled by controlling it's dissolved solids (salts etc.).
You don't have to re-invent the wheel here, just trust the accepted methodology. The idea is to reduce the capability of your water to conduct current, thereby reducing corrosion caused by galvanic cells (dissimilar metal molecules next to each other in your stainless steel alloy mix). Again this is relative, but basically dissimilar metals that are fused together in an alloy create there own electric circuit (or electron flow), this is how thermal couples work. Anyway, in a mixture (an alloy) an electrolyte is also needed to allow this electron flow to occur (like a battery). Reduce the strength of the electrolyte and you will reduce electron flow and thereby reduce corrosion!
*****************
Please, someone with some additional knowledge about this subject offer us some more insight!
Are there OWB dealers out there telling there customers they need to flush their furnaces on some kind of regular basis, or what?
Did you all notice this particular sentence . . . "You don't have to re-invent the wheel here, just trust the accepted methodology"
I'm putting a pic here showing those holes in my Wood Doctor heavy gauge stainless steel furnace . . .
Leaky
[attachment deleted by admin for space issues]
What they were asvising before I had two of their stainless boilers corrode through on me!
And what they're advising now!
But before I do that ....
Eyes Wide Open!
Here is an very interesting blurb I just received from a friend!!
Can't say I know for sure if it is all correct, but it sure sounds feasible to me!!
How Wood Doctor can just sell customers an OWB and then just leave them in the dark about all this stuff, I do not know???
Well hey, they are the ones warrantying the durability of their products against corrosion among other things, so they're actually the ones on the hook to fix these leaking beast, or so you would think!!
My friend says the following in regard to my . . .
"Corroded Leaking FULLY WARRANTIED Heavy Gauge Stainless Steel WOOD DOCTOR Furnace"
*****************
I would venture to suggest, that they may be using 406 stainless as it welds up good with normal steel panels. However, it also has the characteristic of creating galvanic cells within itself if it lays submerged in still brackish water (freshwater with higher then normal chloride levels).
Are you leaving your system full in the summer when not in use and have you tested water for chloride levels (salt). It could be that you are using system in the summer too, but you are not getting enough demand to keep water circulating enough. Whatever the case, it could be that there are pockets of still brackish water forming galvanic cells next to the stainless!
Unless you are regularly blowing down (draining boiler bottom liquid/sludge out under pressure) and topping up with new water you will over time have chloride build up to dangerous levels (levels high enough that the boiler water becomes an electrolyte and allows galvanic cells to form). Then away goes the iron in your stainless steel alloy and oops there is a hole. This will occur mostly near the bottom of your boiler where salt concentrations will be highest!
Monitoring PH levels is good, but PH only helps reduce corrosion by keeping water slightly alkaline. Unfortunately, even alkaline water becomes an electrolyte if chloride (salt) PPM get high enough.
Desired level of chlorides should be around 15-25 PPM, but practically you would probably have difficulty keeping it between 50-75 PPM.
You need to test water with silver nitrate chloride test kit to get PPM. You will likely find that you will need to start draining water regularly to keep chloride levels down. You are shooting yourself in the foot by running the same old soup in system forever, or in this case until it cuts it's own drain holes and runs out on the ground.
In these open systems, boiler water will only continue to build in chloride content as pure water is boiled off (concentrating the soup) and then new water containing even minute levels of salts is added! That is why boiler water neutrality is controlled by controlling it's dissolved solids (salts etc.).
You don't have to re-invent the wheel here, just trust the accepted methodology. The idea is to reduce the capability of your water to conduct current, thereby reducing corrosion caused by galvanic cells (dissimilar metal molecules next to each other in your stainless steel alloy mix). Again this is relative, but basically dissimilar metals that are fused together in an alloy create there own electric circuit (or electron flow), this is how thermal couples work. Anyway, in a mixture (an alloy) an electrolyte is also needed to allow this electron flow to occur (like a battery). Reduce the strength of the electrolyte and you will reduce electron flow and thereby reduce corrosion!
*****************
Please, someone with some additional knowledge about this subject offer us some more insight!
Are there OWB dealers out there telling there customers they need to flush their furnaces on some kind of regular basis, or what?
Did you all notice this particular sentence . . . "You don't have to re-invent the wheel here, just trust the accepted methodology"
I'm putting a pic here showing those holes in my Wood Doctor heavy gauge stainless steel furnace . . .
Leaky
[attachment deleted by admin for space issues]
29
Fire Wood / Re: outside wood boilers--How much wood so far ?
« on: February 09, 2009, 10:32:14 AM »
Hey,
Forgot to say how many Sq Feet I'm heating - 3 buildings within 200 ft for approximately 5,000 Sq Feet.
Leaky
Forgot to say how many Sq Feet I'm heating - 3 buildings within 200 ft for approximately 5,000 Sq Feet.
Leaky
30
Fire Wood / Re: The Best Wood
« on: February 06, 2009, 09:15:08 AM »IRONWOOD
You lucky bastard!
That's pretty dense wood!!!