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[petemoss]

Well, I agree with Ridge. For what you may save in cutting you surely out work me to "prep" your wood to a certain size or shape, so it doesn't "bridge" in your boiler. And the uglies, knots, clumps that you either cut into little pieces or don't use at all, my boiler loves and burns for days on. Then add to that brushing the HX tubes regularly, cleaning out ash more often to insure that no air holes are plugged up......Don't get me wrong, Gassers are more efficient, smoke less and do use less wood...BUT less "work" they are not.
BTW, I had a gasser which did work well but was too small for my application, so I've been there.

no special "prep" for a garn style boiler, bridge problem? don't think so.uglies,knots,clumps&stumps, it don't care. if it fits thru an 18" diameter door it'll burn. HX tubes once a year=30 min. the ash pretty much takes care of itself as it travels thru the heat exchanger at 600 cfm and dumps itself into a 55 Gal. drum outside. but i will say it's alot of work riding my golf cart out to my nice warm shop every other day to build a fire that will last for 4 hrs. to heat 1450 gals. of water back up to 205*   

[martyinmi]

chadley,
   The only extra "prep" that we encounter would be the diameter of the wood, and possibly the length. I split anything over 7" in half, just like I did with my conventional boiler, and the maximum length I can put in mine is a bit over 30". My splitter will only handle 25" anyway,and large rounds are not efficient in either style, as they tend to burn too slow and smoke too much.
   I've never encountered any bridging with either of the gassers I've owned, although some manufacturers designs do lend themselves to bridging. In fact, with my Portage and Main, I just throw it in any old way, crotches, knots, bark, etc.,and as long as I don't let the coal bed level get down too low, it will start burning gas right away every time. I do stir the coals every other day to keep the fine ash from acting as an insulator and allowing the refractory to cool down too much, but I did that with my conventional boiler also, and it's only a 30 second job. Cleaning tubes and ash takes 10 minutes/week.
   Burning wet wood is bound to be a touchy subject, so I'll tread lightly here. Wet wood equals cooler, smokier, less efficient burns in either a conventional or a gasser. Both of the gassers I've owned will burn wood that is not seasoned properly(seasoned wood is 20% moisture content). I was a bit behind last year and burned some that was a over 30%- actually some of it was close to 40%(not real proud of myself there), and the gasser functioned flawlessly. The exchange tubes simply needed more frequent attention.
   The hardest part of burning wood, for myself anyway, is the cutting, bucking, hauling, splitting and stacking. Every time I go to the woods to cut wood, I have about one hour just in road time, plus another few hours of felling, dragging, bucking, and loading just to bring home 1/2 - 3/4 cord of wood, then I split and stack. I always take care of all my brush when I'm done, so I probably take a lot longer than most to process my wood. I usually do it on a Saturday after working all week, and I am physically tired when I'm done. Now instead of spending 15-20 Saturdays/ year gathering wood, I can get buy with 8 or 10. My 10 year old son loves the gasser too, as he is my wood stacker, and it's about half the work for him every year.
   Which ever style you choose, I'd encourage you to keep something very important in mind- only burn well seasoned wood. You being friendly to your neighbors and your environment is a win-win for us all. There are a handful of irresponsible OWB users out there that are giving us all a bad name, and soon enough all of us  will pay for it. 

[jrider]

I sell firewood on the side and throw all of the ugly stuff into seperate piles.  Always had trouble getting rid of it until I got an OWB this fall - a gassification unit.  From the last weekend in Oct until the first week in January I only burned short, long, ugly, knotty, punky (but dry) stuff.  Never had any issues with bridging.  It just burned it up.  So it really was almost 2 and half months of truly free wood. 

[chadley]

okay. what exactly is bridging?   I feel like a 5 year old that asks too many questions. but this whole OWB thing is completely new to me.  Ironically, I've dealt with firewood for years; just didn't know anything about OWB's.  Sorry if I'm a nuisance.

[Ridgekid]

Bridging is when you stock your OWF and the bottom of the pile burns out while the rest is stuck in a "bridge" over the hot ashes.

[martyinmi]

okay. what exactly is bridging?   I feel like a 5 year old that asks too many questions. but this whole OWB thing is completely new to me.  Ironically, I've dealt with firewood for years; just didn't know anything about OWB's.  Sorry if I'm a nuisance.

chadley,
   You have to understand how a downdraft gasifier works before you can understand what bridging is. If you google 'down draft gasifier', you'll be able to watch dozens of videos of many different gasifiers in action. A down draft gasifier burns wood at the very bottom of it's primary burn chamber. The chamber is either force fed with a blower, or a draft inducer on the exhaust is used to create a vacuum. The smoke from combustion is either pushed or pulled through a nozzle in the bottom of the burn chamber where it is ignited by extreme heat. The burning smoke(gas) looks like a torpedo heater pointed downward while the boiler is in operation. Since the fire burns from the very bottom, that is the first place from which wood is depleted. This can lead to a big hole or hollow void under the rest of the wood. If the wood doesn't fall down over the nozzle, then the fire can possibly go out. This is termed "bridging".
   It's hard to explain the gasification process and the effects of bridging. If you view a few videos it will all make perfect sense. 

[tulenutn2o]

chadley,
   From what I've read on the hearth forum, starting sometime in the year 2014, anyone owning an OWB that is not EPA phase 2 compliant will not be able to sell their property with an operational conventional OWB on it. In other words- if you plan on staying on your property for a significant period of time, than a conventional one may be alright for you, as you will be grandfathered in, but the OWB will need to be removed should you decide to sell. If the OWB is the only heat source, it's removal will obviously diminish property value a bit. They are saying that the implementation of the program will be nation wide. I'm not buying it totally until I see something from the EPA. I've sent them 2 email's in the last two weeks and I've not received any response.
   Sorry for that ramble.
   Back to your post now. Gassers, and from what I've read it doesn't matter much what brand, will burn around 40-45% less wood than the average conventional OWB, as much as 60% less than very inefficient OWB's, and about 30-40% less than some of the very efficient ones. They will burn wet wood, however efficiencies suffer a lot- but that is true of a conventional OWB also, and cleaning frequencies will be shortened with wet wood. Cleaning mine takes just under 10 minutes/week of my time. The gasification process has been around for nearly 200 years, and there are OWB company's out there that started making them back in the '90's, so the technology is not new, as  the European's they have been using gassers(usually indoor ones) for more than 3 decades.
   I think it's awesome that people are considering renewable resources to heat their homes. I started out with a conventional OWB about 5 years back, then moved to a gasser last year. At a month shy of 50, hauling 45% less wood home is much easier on these old bones, and although my neighbors had never complained about my conventional OWB, I feel much better that I'm not sending smoke in their direction anymore. I'd now never consider anything other than a gasser. Burning 5 or 6 cords/year is a lot better than going through 9 or 10....or 11. But, hey, I'm gettin' old.

Hopefully, some blow hard politician will actually abolish the EPA before this comes to fruition.

[Jack72]

thanks martyinmi.  That post was helpful.  My local hawken dealer claims that the gassers are not much more efficient than the non gassers.  he says maybe 2 or 3 points which brings me to my first question.  What do the "points" transfer into laymens terms?  Second, why would he try to sell me a lower priced unit?  The hawken GX 10 is around 8 and the HE 2100 is around 7200 (quoted). Last, I've been told there is a lot more maintenance to gassers which kind of goes against what you were saying about less cleaning time.  What are your opinions on maintenance between the two?

 Thanks.  You all have been helpful.

                                           Hello Chadley       
  Your dealer is probably trying to sell a non gasser because he knows that they are going to be outlawed soon in all states and he is going to be stuck with them.          I love my CB e 1450 it takes me 10-15 minutes for a good cleaning               whenever I reload the firebox with  wood I open the the slot around the charge tube to make sure it gets good air flow around the the charge tube and IM good takes a extra 20 seconds and Im good and close door  I cant comment on a non gasser never had one.    The only thing that I think could be better would be the bigger firebox where you could really load up and be good for days if you had to leave for a emergency for 3-4 days    I dont think I could make it more than 24 hours on mine without a reload at 10 degrees outside             Jack 

[chadley]

Jack,

I could see your point but the non gasser he's trying to sell me doesn't fall in our EPA regulations because it is industrial/commercial (10,000 btu) so those will be around for a long while unless the industrial sized non gassers become regulated like the current non gassers.

Now on the other hand, Hardy is trying to sell me an H4 because of the reason you just mentioned.  They have 5 in stock and can't sell them anymore after March in our state.  He's marked them down to 5100 to try and get rid of them.  He tried telling me that the new gassers would make my money back b/c they would cost too much.  I know exactly what he is trying to do.

[slosh250]

chadley,
Could you possibly post of pm a contact on this dealer that is offering them for 5100. Wonder if it would be worth it with shipping? to South Mo

[Schavis]

Gassification vs. non gassification,   some states require certain types... but what ever you do, just don't believe what they say on their web page... Regardless of your heating needs, Hawken Energy has a solution! Choose from our complete product line to heat any building, and meet your other heating needs. There is no heating need or problem that we cannot solve."
Well they can't seem to solve my 6 hour burn time... and they say that my house heating system is wrong and it has to be redone... well it has been that way for over 90 years, how all of a sudden is it no good.... the oil furnace still heats the house, but the Hawken GX10 can't... PROBLEM!

[Sprinter]