Outdoor Wood Furnace Info
All-Purpose OWF Discussions => General Outdoor Furnace Discussion => Topic started by: Scott7m on December 01, 2011, 06:55:53 PM
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Just wondering if anyone here has a plan or has started putting steps in place to be able to self sustain in case of economic collapse or national disaster. I know that most people think that things really couldn't get "that bad" but I don't think it's a matter of if but when, may not be in my lifetime but I want to be prepared that my family will survive whether there is a walmart, lcoal store, mcdonalds, power grid or not.
What say you?
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A little off subject for this forum, but we will have heat! In a few weeks I'll have 6500w generator. I have a 2500w for boating but not big enough for my house but it is for my sons house. I live in the woods and own guns.
We'll survive!
Oh yeah gas for generators? Boat is topped off with 65 gallons. We will get through the initial madness.
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Yea, what happened to the general discussion area, a lot of us here are friends and need a place to converse.
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I have considered this, but can't get around the gasoline aspect
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Not so much for disaster preparedness but I have a 10kW Generac which operates on natural gas or propane. I would like to place my furnace fan on this backup generator but not sure if I can separate it from the 60 amp circuit.
More importantly, my TV stays on and the beer in the fridge stays cold! :thumbup:
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I understand folks wanting to make peeps to have heat in small circumstances but I'm talking about something major. Collapse of economy/govt... Meaning there won't be stores open or gas available.
I guess my idea of disaster is far different than most.... It wouldnt take much to shift us into something like that. A terrorist attack with biological weapons, attacking the water supply, collapse of the economy, hyper inflation, I'm assuming most folks just kick back and say not in the good ol USA, but not me.
I take a bit of pride in knowing that I've Learned from grandparents and such that lived during the depression that one should never be in position to always depend on "the system". Owb's are a step away from the system but still depending on the grid.
I just think and know that I can make simple preparations now that could give me a sustainable food supply for my family if the worst were to occur, what kinda fool would I be if I knew I coulda prevented my kids from being hungry and having them come up to you saying there hungry. I couldn't live with that
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Scott, we think somewhat alike. This is why I was asking in another post about using a gassifier to run a generator. I have plans and hope to start building a still (for fuel) LOL and or a gasiifier to run the generator that I have. About 6 to 8 months of food in the pantry, big garden, lots of deer, turkey, and other critters around here. And I invest in precious metals (lead as in ammo) and steel (as in guns).
Bill
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Scott, we think somewhat alike. This is why I was asking in another post about using a gassifier to run a generator. I have plans and hope to start building a still (for fuel) LOL and or a gasiifier to run the generator that I have. About 6 to 8 months of food in the pantry, big garden, lots of deer, turkey, and other critters around here. And I invest in precious metals (lead as in ammo) and steel (as in guns).
Bill
Yup, nothing wrong with that. I do the same.
I also keep a few chickens/rabbits as they can produce enough food to feed a family in a very very small space.
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If america continues to keep going in the same direction she is going it want be long. Like the rest of you I am not going to depend on our goverment to take care of my family. Younger generation(most of) have no idea how to survive in hard times. (disaster) Like you said Scott its not if but when!!
I am going to do all that is possible to make sure my family is taken care of and what i can't do I will put my trust in the God of heaven and earth to do the rest.
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Victory makes a gasifier that u can run a kohler hydrogen generator on.. looks sweet. Im new to this site and just invested in owb. Its a step in the right direction. Great site by the way
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i have a 10 kw solar panel i feed to the grid and i am sure with a little work i could take it off the grid if were gone and get by about 8 months of the year by conserving (with battery back up)
maybe i should start hoarding 12 volt pumps and motors now? :o
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i have a 10 kw solar panel i feed to the grid and i am sure with a little work i could take it off the grid if were gone and get by about 8 months of the year by conserving (with battery back up)
maybe i should start hoarding 12 volt pumps and motors now? :o
I would.. One thing I'm gonna work on over the next couple years is a 5500kw wind mill. Home made of course. It would be grid tie for the time being
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i have a 10 kw solar panel i feed to the grid and i am sure with a little work i could take it off the grid if were gone and get by about 8 months of the year by conserving (with battery back up)
maybe i should start hoarding 12 volt pumps and motors now? :o
Wow, that must have cost plenty. How big of an area does it cover?
Just hoard inverters and you can run any motors. Lol
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mine is grid tied for a 20 year contract ((or i guess until Hydro 1 (my provider) goes broke)) i have a 20 year rate of 80.2 cents a KW hour.
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mine is grid tied for a 20 year contract ((or i guess until Hydro 1 (my provider) goes broke)) i have a 20 year rate of 80.2 cents a KW hour.
What did u have in the panel? Return on investment and does it help your bill much? Measurements
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mine is grid tied for a 20 year contract ((or i guess until Hydro 1 (my provider) goes broke)) i have a 20 year rate of 80.2 cents a KW hour.
What did u have in the panel? 96,000 Return on investment. this year was my first full year and made just under 15,000 does it help your bill much? it does nothing for my bill, i have a seperate meter that says what i put out and another meter that says what i take in, i pay for what i use and they pay me for what i send, and i like that...i pay about 15 cents a KW hour and they pay 80.2 cent per KWH Measurements i have two towers that follow the sun (up and down and side to side to keep the panels in the optimum position with the sun) and each one has 26 panels that are about 3' x 4' feet ( i think) perhap tmorrow i will take a photo and post it. the only proble with being tied to the grid..when the grid is out so are my panels. this is a safety thing, the panels the way they are hooked up nedd to "feel" incoming power in order to work. If they do not "feel" this power (like when the grid is down) then they can not back feed the grid and electrocute any unsuspecting lines man working on what he thinks is a dead wire
i will measure the panels for size tomorrow and post a photo if i remember
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Cool, I would love to see them Willie
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mine is grid tied for a 20 year contract ((or i guess until Hydro 1 (my provider) goes broke)) i have a 20 year rate of 80.2 cents a KW hour.
What did u have in the panel? 96,000 Return on investment. this year was my first full year and made just under 15,000 does it help your bill much? it does nothing for my bill, i have a seperate meter that says what i put out and another meter that says what i take in, i pay for what i use and they pay me for what i send, and i like that...i pay about 15 cents a KW hour and they pay 80.2 cent per KWH Measurements i have two towers that follow the sun (up and down and side to side to keep the panels in the optimum position with the sun) and each one has 26 panels that are about 3' x 4' feet ( i think) perhap tmorrow i will take a photo and post it. the only proble with being tied to the grid..when the grid is out so are my panels. this is a safety thing, the panels the way they are hooked up nedd to "feel" incoming power in order to work. If they do not "feel" this power (like when the grid is down) then they can not back feed the grid and electrocute any unsuspecting lines man working on what he thinks is a dead wire
i will measure the panels for size tomorrow and post a photo if i remember
The panels are still making power when the grid is down, the inverter just shuts down. You should be able to tie into the DC connection at the inverter and run a normal non-grid tie inverter off it. If you want power when the sun is down you would need batteries.
Solar panel prices are really coming down lately. I have seen them for under $1 per watt lately.
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mine is grid tied for a 20 year contract ((or i guess until Hydro 1 (my provider) goes broke)) i have a 20 year rate of 80.2 cents a KW hour.
What did u have in the panel? 96,000 Return on investment. this year was my first full year and made just under 15,000 does it help your bill much? it does nothing for my bill, i have a seperate meter that says what i put out and another meter that says what i take in, i pay for what i use and they pay me for what i send, and i like that...i pay about 15 cents a KW hour and they pay 80.2 cent per KWH Measurements i have two towers that follow the sun (up and down and side to side to keep the panels in the optimum position with the sun) and each one has 26 panels that are about 3' x 4' feet ( i think) perhap tmorrow i will take a photo and post it. the only proble with being tied to the grid..when the grid is out so are my panels. this is a safety thing, the panels the way they are hooked up nedd to "feel" incoming power in order to work. If they do not "feel" this power (like when the grid is down) then they can not back feed the grid and electrocute any unsuspecting lines man working on what he thinks is a dead wire
i will measure the panels for size tomorrow and post a photo if i remember
The panels are still making power when the grid is down, the inverter just shuts down. You should be able to tie into the DC connection at the inverter and run a normal non-grid tie inverter off it. If you want power when the sun is down you would need batteries.
Solar panel prices are really coming down lately. I have seen them for under $1 per watt lately.
i dont have A inverter, i have what is known as micro inverter, 1 for every panel, 52 panels and 52 inverters
i do think there would be a way to bypass the safety device for the grid if i was going off grid. i may just write teh company and ask them
as for prices..yes i think they are coming down but so is the price the government here is paying. i think the price for a contract now has gone to about 60 cents pe KWH but i am not sure, there is talk of lowering it again soon
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The fact they pay you 80 cents and u pay 15 is good for you but sounds like the fleecing of America lol
I wish I could find out about govt programs for this type stuff. How did you go about that? So the panels were 96000?? What % did uhave to pay
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scott im in canada..i borrowed every cent all i needed was collateral. witht he government contract the banks did not require down payments. this was a govenrment incentive to get green power going here in canada on a small scale level
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I see.. There are similar programs here, but to hire someone to do the leg work through the 168392 levels of govt, it kinda makes it not feasible.
It's nearly impossible to wade through the bureaucracy. However, I'm still interested and think you have a great thing going.
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i too hope it works out..i think i am about one of about 4000 that are hooked to the grid and there are about (last i read) 16000 applications. there are a lot of windmills going up also for power but they are in teh megawatts..big players or lots of investors
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Just checked online and our provider will only pay .12 per kw...
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Scott, wouldn't that be .24 per kWh?
Also, willieG, I would seem to think that there would be a switch that would be available to kill power to the grid in the event of power outage, allowing you to have backup power without toasting the linemen. Thats how my transfer switch works for my backup generator. I envy your solar grid!
Michael
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i talked to skystream wind gen and they do the same if power gos down so dose power from windmill for safty on line man but . found out you can instal a diconect going to the main lines i was told it only takes 12v and the board will think there is still power and start back up
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Nope, Just 0.12 per kwh
Bee man be careful with sky stream, heard a lot of bad about em
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I'd like to stay warm if anything ever went down. But if the SHTF, I'd probably just relocate to a warmer state. What I'm concerned with is power outages. Not the couple hours ones but the couple days ones.
I'd like to get a generator to power my two Taco pumps and the stove.
You think a 3000W generator would be enough?
Don't really care about lights, or fridge.
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Scratch. In a real disaster, how would you relocate? Do you have fuel storage?
In a true disaster gas pumps won't be in operation period. Now power, water for those on the system will quickly run out, no stores open. Chaos
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scott they had one of there display at santafae day when i talked to him butttt i am to poor to buy been looking at building my own with solor power just thinking
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Hey bee man, a project you can do and likely afford is a breezy 5.5 wind turbine. Most all of it is off the shelf stuff and they work great. Just google breezy 5.5, also videos on youtube
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no photos today boys..rained all day and no sun so panels never stood up to an angle that would make a picture.
maybe tomorrow
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Scott, wouldn't that be .24 per kWh?
Also, willieG, I would seem to think that there would be a switch that would be available to kill power to the grid in the event of power outage, allowing you to have backup power without toasting the linemen. Thats how my transfer switch works for my backup generator. I envy your solar grid!
Michael
i would have to get a transfer switch of some sort installed between my grid home meter and the grid. the way this thing is hooked up is my solar goes to "outbound meter" and feeds directly into the lines at the exact location of my "inbound meter" i would have to have some sort of switch that when set to feed teh house only from the solar that the grid would be disconnected..and not be able to be tampered with to cheat my provider.
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You need to grid for the inverters to put anything out. You might be able to use an inverter or generator to get them going but they usually get fried if connecting power to the output of them.
If something happened like this post is about it would be worth a try. Just go out and cut the wires at the transformer before the meters and feed power in there. It should route through the meters and into your house.
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you would still have to fool the board that there is still power
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i thnk that could be bypassed or provided with a battery bank (i would want one of these to power the needed things at night anyeay)
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All,
I started two years ago to be as self sufficient as I can for my family. We are now completely off-grid (PV with battery backup) and we also have a propane generator as secondary backup. Our heat and DHW is OWB with propane backup. We've built a passive solar greenhouse this year with the goal of growing most of our food. We've co opted with a farmer here for fresh eggs, milk, beef and pork. We have bought several weeks of 25year food stores. I too am vested in precious metals (ammo/guns) along with silver.
About three weeks ago, we have a tremendous wind storm that left our entire valley without power for a full five days, knocking down 83 utitility poles and damaging the local power station. Thankfully, we had power when virtually no one else in the valley had power or water as most have wells in this area. This all with below freezing temperatures were present.
This country is heading for an implosion economically and spiritually. We can certainly find the culprits to blame, but that doesn't protect your family. We have to live sustainable lives, something no one in this country as done for forty or more years. Someone in this post talked about their grandparents and knowing how to live off the land. That is part of the solution.
My grandfather lost all of his wealth in the great depression by leaving his money in the bank, which the government told him was safe, much like what you hear on advertisement today with Susie Orman. Make no mistake about, this concept of a new world order will disinfranchise the US, destroy our soverignty as a nation, and put us in bondage to the money changers, i.e., the FED, IMF, etc. They are changing money from our hands to theirs on a grand scale by derivitives, bond fraud, and currency devaluation. Long story short, we are being attacked on every front. We are being poisoned by the perservatives in food we eat, regulated by the FDA on healthy food we can no longer legally buy, then finished off by the pharmaceutical companies in their quest for total domination of health care. Our government is using our military and influence in the world to over throw sovereign nations leading to more of those nations to fall into the hands of Islamic extremist. We are no longer the peacekeepers, but the aggressors.
I know I am rambling, so I will stop. Let's quit depending on the government to provide stability for our families and take ownership of that responsibility ourselves as it should be. We may not be 100% ready for any eventuality, but we will know what to do to lessen the impact of events beyond our control.
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:post:
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here are some links to photos of my solar panels
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h308/billie_boy7/085.jpg (http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h308/billie_boy7/085.jpg)
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h308/billie_boy7/088.jpg (http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h308/billie_boy7/088.jpg) close up of one panel 5 feet wide 42 inches high
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h308/billie_boy7/089.jpg (http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h308/billie_boy7/089.jpg) you can see the wind meter on teh little pole in this photo
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If you see a truck flying down the road with what appears to be an oversized spoiler, its just me 'borrowing' one of willieg's panels!
Seriously though, I assume those are insured in some way? I mean besides the trusty shotgun, does your homeowners cover those panels or what?
Michael
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seperate policy between 4 and 5 hundred per year
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MTJAG, you set an example we should all work to follow. ramble anytime.
Hey thanks much. It seems that most people here with OWBs are moving in the right direction. We just have to challenge the status quo and the mind set that big government will protect us and can be trusted to have our best interest in mind.
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MTJAG, you set an example we should all work to follow. ramble anytime.
Hey thanks much. It seems that most people here with OWBs are moving in the right direction. We just have to challenge the status quo and the mind set that big government will protect us and can be trusted to have our best interest in mind.
How far are you from the Denver airport?
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WILLIE,what are you worried about?the obahma train dont run up there!
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Very nice looking setup Willie
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WILLIE,what are you worried about?the obahma train dont run up there!
more so than you think..it seems we are more than neighbours our politicians do as they are told and the same guys that tell obama's gang what to do are telling ours as well...we are ten times smaller so it just takes a little longer for the 'cancer" to surface
i dont want to sound like chicken little and scream the sky is falling but i really believe we are on the brink of a real north american melt down. our countries have (in the last few years) tried to spend their way out of a recession and it isn't working..what is next.. i surely have no idea but i think the worst is yet to come
we burn wood to save money, grow much of our own food and do a little hunting for meat on occasion..perhaps we will have to do more of this in the future but how will the city folk survive? we are all spoiled, hit the switch you got lights, heat and entertainment.
i am only in my 50's but grew up in an area that was last to get some of these luxuries in the country. i can remember vistiing friends of my dads that still had no indoor plumbing, or electric power and sat at the kitchen table playing cards by coal oil lamp. i thought that was cool cause it looked like the westerns i seen on tv!
we (as the general public) have been spoiled and led down the garden path for too long..we will have to pay for this sometime.
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here is a tid bit i looked up tonight...
Tax Freedom Day
in the USA tax freedom day for the year 2011 was forcast as April 12
in Canada the same tax freedom day was forcast for June 6
this date is an average of when the nation as a whole had paid it's taxation level for the year (not including national debt)
in the USA it is averaged out at about 26 percent of your income! in Canada it is an average of 42 percent of our income!!!