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Electronics / Aquastat to back up OWB
« on: October 16, 2013, 11:51:22 AM »
I have four zones/thermostats. One thermostat is connected to the TT terminals on the aquastat and upon a call for heat will start the oil burner. The other three connect to circulator pumps that are triggered by the other thermostats, but are independent of the oil burner. The aquastat is a R8182D, which I have wired for cold start. The oil heating unit is a Burnham V-15A-T.
I want to run that one thermostat independent of the oil burner. However, I want the oil burner to kick on when the temperature falls below some threshold I determine. For two reasons, sometimes the OWB cannot keep up with the demand and I want the oil burner to provide a little bump. And if for some reason the OWB fails to provide heat, e.g., the fire goes out while I'm away and have someone supposedly filling it, or, whatever.
What aquastat, contact type I presume, would you recommend and how should I wire it. Could I wire it to start the burner at, let's say 115, and remain on to another temperature of my choosing, perhaps 150. I don't think using a low limit only would serve my purpose. That is, if my understanding is accurate, that would allow me to use 115, but with the max differential (25) the high temperature would be 130.
Would one of those Honeywell's that I could wire to the TT terminals work? Or perhaps a Ranco and turn line voltage on/off to the burner, or with a 24V transformer? How would that be connected? There is an OWB loop, HX, and house side loop. Hot water baseboard radiators.
Thanks guys,
Gary
I want to run that one thermostat independent of the oil burner. However, I want the oil burner to kick on when the temperature falls below some threshold I determine. For two reasons, sometimes the OWB cannot keep up with the demand and I want the oil burner to provide a little bump. And if for some reason the OWB fails to provide heat, e.g., the fire goes out while I'm away and have someone supposedly filling it, or, whatever.
What aquastat, contact type I presume, would you recommend and how should I wire it. Could I wire it to start the burner at, let's say 115, and remain on to another temperature of my choosing, perhaps 150. I don't think using a low limit only would serve my purpose. That is, if my understanding is accurate, that would allow me to use 115, but with the max differential (25) the high temperature would be 130.
Would one of those Honeywell's that I could wire to the TT terminals work? Or perhaps a Ranco and turn line voltage on/off to the burner, or with a 24V transformer? How would that be connected? There is an OWB loop, HX, and house side loop. Hot water baseboard radiators.
Thanks guys,
Gary
2
General Outdoor Furnace Discussion / Re: welding leak in firebox water jacket
« on: January 21, 2013, 05:03:17 AM »
Boilerman, you are right on the money! And that's exactly what it is, and exactly what I did. I went in "cold", that is, down a voltage setting to reduce the penetration, built up some weld around the perimeter of the button and then across the top. Ground it down, and voila! Filled it back up and if it isn't leaking this AM will fire it up. The hardest part was wiring in an extension cord for the Lincoln 215 (it's much more than I need but I couldn't pass up the deal...nearly new for $700) to get to the boiler, ~50 ft. Although, cleaning out the firebox sufficiently to climb in was kind of a drag. Oh, and I put a piece of plywood down inside to kneel on while welding...just in case.
Thanks everyone,
G
Thanks everyone,
G
3
General Outdoor Furnace Discussion / Re: welding leak in firebox water jacket
« on: January 20, 2013, 11:17:52 AM »
thanx guys, I have a MIG welder and use gas. It's a long story, but that I have a welder doesn't necessarily make me one, ergo the questions. I'll se if I can't dig up something to use as a patch. I gave the area a couple of whacks and it seems solid. A square piece from some angle iron should work.
4
General Outdoor Furnace Discussion / welding leak in firebox water jacket
« on: January 20, 2013, 08:54:03 AM »
I have an ~11 yr. old Central Boiler, CL 5848SB, that has sprung a leak from one of those button looking welds on the inside of the firebox. Can I just crawl in there and mig weld some bead over the spot and come out alive, and the leak have stopped?
Thanks,
G
Thanks,
G
5
General Outdoor Furnace Discussion / Re: Stacked plate HX sizing help needed
« on: January 28, 2012, 05:44:03 AM »
Thanks everyone for all your help and suggestions!
RSI...I called my oil people and from the nozzle specs determined that my oil burner is ~125,000 BTU.
I will swap those pumps. The consensus is, here and elsewhere, that short of replacing the 1 in. pex with 1 1/4 - 1 1/2....really, I'm screwed. Although I clearly do need the larger HX, flow is a major issue and that the pipe is 1 in. is the limiting factor. The pump issue has been discussed in detail here, elsewhere, and with my contact at Syracuse Thermal. None of the alternatives really solves the flow deficiency. So, I'll live with it...for now.
RSI...what are your thoughts regarding going without an HX? Assuming, of course, there was by-pass plumbing to loop the WFB water without going through the oil fired boiler.
RSI...I called my oil people and from the nozzle specs determined that my oil burner is ~125,000 BTU.
I will swap those pumps. The consensus is, here and elsewhere, that short of replacing the 1 in. pex with 1 1/4 - 1 1/2....really, I'm screwed. Although I clearly do need the larger HX, flow is a major issue and that the pipe is 1 in. is the limiting factor. The pump issue has been discussed in detail here, elsewhere, and with my contact at Syracuse Thermal. None of the alternatives really solves the flow deficiency. So, I'll live with it...for now.
RSI...what are your thoughts regarding going without an HX? Assuming, of course, there was by-pass plumbing to loop the WFB water without going through the oil fired boiler.
6
General Outdoor Furnace Discussion / Re: Stacked plate HX sizing help needed
« on: January 27, 2012, 06:02:37 AM »
Hmmm, that's a thought. Nah, it's fraught with peril. There are a couple of good reasons I that come to mind as to why that wouldn't work so well for me.
7
General Outdoor Furnace Discussion / Re: Stacked plate HX sizing help needed
« on: January 26, 2012, 03:47:20 PM »
As far as I know, they were the original pumps, so at least ten years old.
It is kind of humid during the summer, but not inordinately so...it's upstate NY, western Catskills.
I'm going to swap the 014 at the WFB with the PL-36 in the house, putting the larger pump in service on the longer run.
I'd still like to get an intelligent recommendation regarding the appropriate HX for my application. I mean, everyone has one...how was it chosen? Or were they provided by the WFB people and that was that?
It is kind of humid during the summer, but not inordinately so...it's upstate NY, western Catskills.
I'm going to swap the 014 at the WFB with the PL-36 in the house, putting the larger pump in service on the longer run.
I'd still like to get an intelligent recommendation regarding the appropriate HX for my application. I mean, everyone has one...how was it chosen? Or were they provided by the WFB people and that was that?
8
General Outdoor Furnace Discussion / Re: Stacked plate HX sizing help needed
« on: January 25, 2012, 03:41:27 PM »
One began to complain and then had a seizure, the other froze over a summer.
9
General Outdoor Furnace Discussion / Re: Stacked plate HX sizing help needed
« on: January 25, 2012, 02:12:05 PM »
Since this AM I measured the distance from the house to the boiler and it is 205 ft plus about 20 ft inside making the total loop 430 ft. The line from the boiler melts snow on the ground so I suspect it is not buried below the frost line.
Muffin, click on the link in the first post to get you to photos of the system.
They are Taco 014's, not 012's and they replaced the PL36's that wore out since I bought the house. They were provided by the place the CB had been purchased from and were supposedly the same as PL36's.
It is correct that the PL36 circulates water through the HX and oil fired boiler. The 20 plate HX has been too small from the beginning and was wondering if just how much larger an HX should be there could be determined by a method other than a vague...well, 70 plates should do the trick.
There is one Taco 014 pumping water from the CB to the house and another one pumping water in a separate, much shorter, loop to the barn. In those photos, the barn can be seen next to the WFB.
So should there be a larger capacity pump for a 430 ft loop?
Thanks,
G
Muffin, click on the link in the first post to get you to photos of the system.
They are Taco 014's, not 012's and they replaced the PL36's that wore out since I bought the house. They were provided by the place the CB had been purchased from and were supposedly the same as PL36's.
It is correct that the PL36 circulates water through the HX and oil fired boiler. The 20 plate HX has been too small from the beginning and was wondering if just how much larger an HX should be there could be determined by a method other than a vague...well, 70 plates should do the trick.
There is one Taco 014 pumping water from the CB to the house and another one pumping water in a separate, much shorter, loop to the barn. In those photos, the barn can be seen next to the WFB.
So should there be a larger capacity pump for a 430 ft loop?
Thanks,
G
10
General Outdoor Furnace Discussion / Stacked plate HX sizing help needed
« on: January 25, 2012, 07:08:50 AM »
Hi guys,
I have just gotten on the this site. Looks like a great resource. I need some help sizing a new HX for my system. Disclaimer: I bought this house with all of the system already here already. Some photos are posted here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/toogbrand/sets/72157628953640877/
I have a 2001 CL 5648SB that is 200 ft from the house that provides hot water for finned baseboard radiators and domestic hot water. And is integrated with the oil fired boiler. It also provides heat via a water/air HX to a 900 sq ft finished space in the barn.My current HX is a B&G BP412-20. I have always felt that it is significantly undersized. It now behaves as though its flow has become restricted, there are mineral deposits impeding heat transfer, or both. That is, when a cold zone calls for heat, the water temp on the house side drops like a stone and requires the oil burner to kick on to maintain a reasonable temperature. It didn't do that till this year.
There are four zones in a 3100 sq ft split level (4) house with an open floor plan and vaulted ceilings. The total radiator footage is ~182 ft. One of the zones has radiators on three levels totaling ~100 ft. As to how much more pipe comprises the system, who knows, but it's a lot. My local purveyor of CB's had a recommendation something like....Well, that 20 plate is definitely too small and we would usually install a 50 or 70 plate unit for a house your size. I think you need a 70.
My 412-20 has 1 in ports and is 4 X 12 in. The only reasonably accurate temperature I can provide is that the water leaves the WFB at 180 and arrives at the house ~170. The pumps at the WFB are Taco 014's and circulation through the HX in the house is by a B&G PL36. The system is 1 in PEX. The house side is 3/4 Cu with 007 Taco's.
What say you? And I read with great interest the 8 p. post regarding temperature monitoring, something I had just begun to design myself. Some excellent ideas.
Thanks,
G
I have just gotten on the this site. Looks like a great resource. I need some help sizing a new HX for my system. Disclaimer: I bought this house with all of the system already here already. Some photos are posted here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/toogbrand/sets/72157628953640877/
I have a 2001 CL 5648SB that is 200 ft from the house that provides hot water for finned baseboard radiators and domestic hot water. And is integrated with the oil fired boiler. It also provides heat via a water/air HX to a 900 sq ft finished space in the barn.My current HX is a B&G BP412-20. I have always felt that it is significantly undersized. It now behaves as though its flow has become restricted, there are mineral deposits impeding heat transfer, or both. That is, when a cold zone calls for heat, the water temp on the house side drops like a stone and requires the oil burner to kick on to maintain a reasonable temperature. It didn't do that till this year.
There are four zones in a 3100 sq ft split level (4) house with an open floor plan and vaulted ceilings. The total radiator footage is ~182 ft. One of the zones has radiators on three levels totaling ~100 ft. As to how much more pipe comprises the system, who knows, but it's a lot. My local purveyor of CB's had a recommendation something like....Well, that 20 plate is definitely too small and we would usually install a 50 or 70 plate unit for a house your size. I think you need a 70.
My 412-20 has 1 in ports and is 4 X 12 in. The only reasonably accurate temperature I can provide is that the water leaves the WFB at 180 and arrives at the house ~170. The pumps at the WFB are Taco 014's and circulation through the HX in the house is by a B&G PL36. The system is 1 in PEX. The house side is 3/4 Cu with 007 Taco's.
What say you? And I read with great interest the 8 p. post regarding temperature monitoring, something I had just begun to design myself. Some excellent ideas.
Thanks,
G
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