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[Michael]

When I found the 400 HE I quit looking.

[woodwest]

There are lots of things to consider. These are just a couple.... How much wood you have to feed the furnace, typically a furnace with an open heat exchanger with a single shot will consume alot more wood to reach and maintain the operating temperature (you don't want to be a wood slave).  The other thing to consider is not so much the thickness of the metal (as that is not what generally fails, do not recall ever seeing a peice of 1/4 inch plate steel with a hole rusted through it) WELDS are what fail.  I bought the Portage and Main Furnace they double weld all critical joints.  They also do not mix types of metal example stainless steel with cold rolled plate, this appears to never work as different metals expand and contract at different rates resulting in weld failures. They have been in biz since 1973. I would recommend giving them a real close look. Happy reading!

[leolends]

I did the exact same thing, spent 6 months or so researching and talking to MFG's who by the way all "sell the best" everyone I spoke is said the exact same thing "our's is the best"  After weeding through the BS and narrowing it down to a few I bought the Heat Master 5000e 3 months ago and so far it's been great! Well build, nice additional burn chamber, easy to clean ash pan with shake grates,  burns very little wood.  I will tell you my head was spinning with all the opinions of all these dealers and MFG's I finally bit the bullet and think it was a great choice.

Good luck with the search and purchase, I am now going 3 months without paying for any home heating , hot water or swimming pool heating propane!

[Scott7m]

Forums can be good, forums can be bad, sadly enough most the info you see on them isn't near correct at best.  You see folks bragging up there purchases when they've only ran them a few days or simply watched there furnace installation and are suddenly experts.  Finding a dealer who does this thing for a living is a key point, people who do this on the side or hire out the labor will never be able to answer your questions with any degree of certainty.  be careful and be extremely Leary of the "good deal"

[walkerdogman85]

Hey scott why can't someone who had there owb installed answer questions with certainty? Not trying to start anything but the way I see it dealers sell there product and push it the same as some individual would. Mabye I miss understood your post. I guess I don't see why we can't answer questions? I have learned alot since my install try ti learn as much as I can from here.

[netwerx-r-us]

Wow,  that's a pretty strong statement Scott , I come to the forums to get opinions and ideas  , some better than others , I've seen the "Experts" on this site , you included ,  have different opinions on how something is done, I respect all of their opinions ,  that being said I'm probably as green as they come but I  can share my experiences ( as limited as they are ) and yes my opinions with others . when the day comes that I'm an expert and can no longer learn from others is the day I need to use that OWB for its alternate use and save the crematorium fees , I'm 50 years old  and still learning and will continue to do so until its time to go , life is way to short to sweat the small stuff   

[boilerman]

I don't think Scott is telling anyone they can't post their thoughts or share experiences on a forum, but to beware, because everything you read on the internet just may not always be true, a proven fact or nothing more than an opinion. There are posters that don't even have more than 1 season or even less experience on their new start up companies furnace, proclaiming that is absolutely the "greatest ever" and only cost them a few thousand dollars.  I've been an OWF furnace owner now into my 11th season. I've seen many companies come and go in less than 5 years, when the problems start and they start getting "hits" on their fantastic great warranties. Nothing is proven until after years of customer use. Some companies claim they have been in business for 20-30 years, but no one has ever heard or them or seen one until the last 2 years. Also keep in mind, that in less than a year, it is very possible that any furnace sold in the U.S. must meet EPA requirements that will probably put any company out of business all together if they can't produce one and get it EPA certified. Anyway, share stories, ask questions and weigh out the answers and options. I still feel more comfortable with truely proven companies...IMO

[Scott7m]

Boiler man is correct in his entire statement, once EPA phase 2 regs go nationwide, the boiler industry will never look the same.  Only a select few will remain


What i mean is every situation is different, you may see your isntall and say well that's how it works.  The thing is there is unique parts of every install that are often specific to that certain situation.  You see folks on here all the time recommending things that are detrimental to a boiler, but you can't correct every or even attempt to try.  Often things are really hard to put into words too, like I might know of why a certain problem is occurring based on experience but could never make it make sense to someone Eho isn't involved in this as well. 

[dwneast77]

Forums can be good, forums can be bad, sadly enough most the info you see on them isn't near correct at best.  You see folks bragging up there purchases when they've only ran them a few days or simply watched there furnace installation and are suddenly experts.  Finding a dealer who does this thing for a living is a key point, people who do this on the side or hire out the labor will never be able to answer your questions with any degree of certainty.  be careful and be extremely Leary of the "good deal"

I both agree (feeling novice myself sometimes) and disagree in that even though many users out here are new to OWBs, many of them are still experienced at burning wood. 

walkerdogman - I also agree with you.  This site has a wealth of knowledge. 

I grew up burning wood.  Got away from it, due to the extra work and cheap oil.  Started re-implementing wood furnaces in the early/mid 2000's and then jumped into the OWB scene with Central Boilers first gasser model.  Big Mistake on one hand and the best thing we ever did on the other.  This is the start of my fifth season.  I had absolutely NO knowledge of boilers of any kind as all I grew up with was forced-air heating.  I had never even soldered a copper fitting.  Now I have and proudly I can say I've never had a leak.  I asked a few questions of the right people and it's been a learning experience every day.  By no means do I consider myself an expert on the subject.  I try to think things through and I've gathered a lot of useful ideas and great information from this site.  And I've spent a great deal of time offering my experiences to attempt to help others. 

People do need to be cautious of the information they choose to implement into their system.  Mostly it's common sense when you stop and think about it.  Often it is easy to overlook something.  Usually it's the little things we miss.   So even the simplest of suggestions can make all the difference to someone.

leolends - You are correct IMO also.  Salesman are salesman.  They will all push their product as "the best". 

woodwest - During my 4th season, I had 2 leaky seams in my E-2300.  However, another guy I know with the exact same stove had to replace a large section of the right side wall in his firebox do to creosote eating it away at 4 years old and he burns year round.   Also, in examining my firebox, I see a lot of pitting both walls and ceiling and the metal is sounding thin when hit.  I give it a season or 2 before major problems, if I'm lucky.    I stongly urge anyone with a gasser OWB to watch the inside of their firebox closely for deterioration.  The walls are almost always wet with creosote and there is no way I can think of to avoid it.  It's the nature of the beast.  Maybe CB is using better steel now, I hope so. 

My $0.02 worth.

Jeff

[Scott7m]

Hey scott why can't someone who had there owb installed answer questions with certainty? Not trying to start anything but the way I see it dealers sell there product and push it the same as some individual would. Mabye I miss understood your post. I guess I don't see why we can't answer questions? I have learned alot since my install try ti learn as much as I can from here.

You misunderstood what I meant, I just see folks answering technical questions based on there 3 weeks experience, there answers often reflect they don't understand what's going on.  The forum is an excellent place to learn, but you must decipher through a lot of talk and dig to the bottom of it

[yoderheating]

 Scott makes some good points. I have installed hundreds of furnaces and many things that work well for one home owner will not work at all for another. So many variables go into a install. Its similar to buying a car, not everyone should be driving a 4x4 truck but some have to have them. Not everyone needs a little car which gets 40mpg but some couldn't afford to get to work if they didn't have them. Each job is very different and if the dealer isn't experienced enough to recognize potential problems you may be in for a problem.
 The number one thing to look at when you buy a furnace is to have a dealer who knows what he is doing. It can be worth thousands, I know because I have calls all the time from people who are having to pay someone else to come out and fix mistakes. Also buy from a company who will be there if you have a warranty issue. There have been a number of companies who go out of business simply to skip out on warranty work, then next week they are selling under a new name.
 

[walkerdogman85]

Sorry Scott for mabye getting defensive but like I said I am new to the outdoor wood burner. This will be my first full winter using it.  I have learned alot here and hope to continue to do so.

[Scott7m]

Sorry Scott for mabye getting defensive but like I said I am new to the outdoor wood burner. This will be my first full winter using it.  I have learned alot here and hope to continue to do so.

No problem....   

[rick w]

i am on my 3rd season with a portage & main ml36 wood burning machine and i dont regret the purchase one bit. they are worth the extra money they are bullet proof. i have never seen a spark come out of my stack with the smoke chamber anything hot goes through the chamber by the time it hits the exit and up the stack its cool.easy maintance .stack can be cleaned from the ground just open the inspection port on the back of the stove once a month push the chimney brush up and down a few times clean out port of creosote put cap back on your done no climbing on the roof. clean out smoke chamber once a month with scraper once a month yuor done. no auger to jam up just use your scraper morning and evening when filling move ashes around and fill with 6 to8 pieces of wood. pretty simple and quick. when they say cut wood consuption by 1/3to 1/2 i can vouch for that. spend the little extra. i am darn glad i did happy burning rick

[woodwest]

True....More areas of the USA are moving to EPA Phase II units being the only type of OWF allowed. There appear to be only a few companies that have successfully ventured into this territory of obtaining approval.  Thus why I purchased the Portage and Main Optimizer 250, it has EPA Phase II approval as do all their Optimizer series and again they have been in biz since 1973, I think it is safe to say they will be around for a while yet.  These guys are selling lots into the North Eastern part of the USA yet made in Canada! Burns clean, less wood, more efficient. Happy with mine!