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[bruiserjeep]

Hello, I'm new to the forum and I do not as yet have an OWB. That's the reason I joined maybe get some advice and suggestions on what would be best what to look out for and such. I live in southeast Kansas in a 1-1/2 story house about 3000 square feet, I built it about 4 years ago it is well insulated with ICF walls and modern windows. I currently have a heatpump for heat my last electric bill was $450, I live on 80 acres with plenty of hedge trees I need to make use of them.

My first question is most of you I noticed live in colder parts of the country here the last couple weeks it was down in the single digits and did not get much above 20 but now it's warmed up and will be about 60 today. since we go through such warm and cold cycles does that have any consideration for what type stove I should get? What effect would this have on a gassefier?

[Roger2561]

Hello, I'm new to the forum and I do not as yet have an OWB. That's the reason I joined maybe get some advice and suggestions on what would be best what to look out for and such. I live in southeast Kansas in a 1-1/2 story house about 3000 square feet, I built it about 4 years ago it is well insulated with ICF walls and modern windows. I currently have a heatpump for heat my last electric bill was $450, I live on 80 acres with plenty of hedge trees I need to make use of them.

My first question is most of you I noticed live in colder parts of the country here the last couple weeks it was down in the single digits and did not get much above 20 but now it's warmed up and will be about 60 today. since we go through such warm and cold cycles does that have any consideration for what type stove I should get? What effect would this have on a gassefier?

Bruiserjeep - Welcome to the forum.  You'll like it in here.  Smart people here.  Do your homework.  Check with your local code enforcement officer regarding the use of a gasser (EPA II compliant) OWB, versus a non-gasser.  In my state (NH) I had no choise, I had to go with a gasser.  Also, you'll want check to see if there are any requirements regarding setback from neighbor's property line and the chimney height.  Check with you home owners insurance to see if there are any restrictions.  Actually, my home owners insurance went down a tick due to the fire hazard being away from the house.  I am not saying this is the case with your insurance, just pointing out the possibilities.  And, if you get the gasser, you'll have to be sure to have your wood dry before you burn it.  That means having to stockpile enough for a couples year to dry before burning it.   

I'm heating a 3000sqft, 1840's farmhouse and domestic hot-water (DHW) with so, so insulation.  I'm heating it with a Central Boiler E-classic 1400 (It's a gasser).  The past 2 seasons I went through approx 6 to 6 1/2 cord of wood.  This year due to the extreme cold in December and January I'll be using about 7 to 7 1/2 cord of wood.  I keep my house a comfortable 70 degrees, 24/7.  The oil furnace hasn't run since I fired up the OWB in October.  Didi I mention it cost me over $5,100.00 a year for fuel oil?  That was the main reason I went with the OWB.  I get my fire wood log length at $100.00 per cord.  That was a no brainer, going from paying out over $5,100.00 per year down to about $600.00 to $700.00 a year to heat my house.  I don't use the OWB in the summer.  I want to stay on the good side of my neighbors.  I hope this help.  Roger

[bruiserjeep]

Thanks Roger, I will double check about the EPA requirements but I am sure there are non, Kansas is pretty open about that. As for neighbors my closest ones are at least a half mile away. One of my big concerns is when we have our warm periods will the fire go out before the next heat cycle? One of the reasons I asked about a gasser is there is one listed for sale in central KS, it is a Nature's Comfort GT220, they are asking $5250 for it and has been used for three seasons. I was planning on buying a heater next fall but if this sounds like a good deal I would consider it.

This brings me to another question my house is two story and the second system is upstairs, the other is in the basement, I'm guessing that the head height will be close to 20' from the OWB, will those circulation pumps handle that? Also two heating unit and DHW as well I would like to heat my attached garage I am guessing that four HX in series would be a bit much. what would be the best way to handle something like that? Thanks for the help.

[mlappin]

Thanks Roger, I will double check about the EPA requirements but I am sure there are non, Kansas is pretty open about that. As for neighbors my closest ones are at least a half mile away. One of my big concerns is when we have our warm periods will the fire go out before the next heat cycle? One of the reasons I asked about a gasser is there is one listed for sale in central KS, it is a Nature's Comfort GT220, they are asking $5250 for it and has been used for three seasons. I was planning on buying a heater next fall but if this sounds like a good deal I would consider it.

This brings me to another question my house is two story and the second system is upstairs, the other is in the basement, I'm guessing that the head height will be close to 20' from the OWB, will those circulation pumps handle that? Also two heating unit and DHW as well I would like to heat my attached garage I am guessing that four HX in series would be a bit much. what would be the best way to handle something like that? Thanks for the help.

Have another guy on the site that has a GT-220, he's happy enough with it I guess but he feels it could be more efficient with added heat exchanger passes like the newer GT-6000 uses.
http://outdoorwoodfurnaceinfo.com/forum/index.php?topic=4090.0

[racnruss]

Hey, that's me! 

Yeah, check out that thread.  I'm totally honest about what I have and am not one of those guys who says what he has is the best.   I've tried to list positives and negatives about my boiler and others that I've been around.

I believe NC makes a solid boiler.  I've never had to weld mine or any that my friends and family own.  The 220 was an early gasifier and since then NC has improved the efficiency by increasing the heat exchange area in the Gt 6000.  Would I buy a gasser if I lived in the country? No.  Would I buy another Nature's comfort boiler?  Yes.  I would consider Heatmaster and Portage and Main even more so.

[juddspaintballs]

For the second system upstairs, I would honestly use a separate loop using a water/water heat exchanger and a separate circulator for it.  That way, the head pressure can never be an issue for the main loop to/from your boiler.  In fact, I would also run your garage on a completely separate and closed loop as well so you can fill that loop with antifreeze and shut it down if you don't want to heat your garage all the time and not have to worry about it freezing. 

If you have a basement system, 2nd floor system, DHW, and garage all to heat, the most efficient way to run it will be using one main run loop with 4 smaller loops with their own circulators coming off of it.  The garage and 2nd story I would make closed loops as I previously explained.  The basement and DHW don't need to be closed off from the main loop.

[bruiserjeep]

Rancruss - Followed your thread it appears the GT220 isn't as efficient as other/newer gassers that being said will it consume less wood than a conventional OWB? My wood is free but I still have to cut it so the less usage=less work. As I mentioned in previously there is a used one for sale I can go get but I would not buy a gasser if I have to pay new price.

Juddspaintballs - If I understand I can run a main loop that includes the downstairs/basement heater (it's the same unit) than to a DHW than to a HX for the other loop(s). Can I put a hot water tank in the basement as the HX and pull the other loops off of that? Or should I use plate HX for the other loops? Or is there some other way to do this? this is all new to me but thanks for your help.

[juddspaintballs]

There are a lot of options for running a separate loop.  I would personally use a plate exchanger for the water/water exchange.

Your basement and 2nd floor heat, is that forced air or hot water? 

[HawkenRep]

Check these awesome videos from Hawken Energy!!! You won't be dissapointed that you took the time to watch these.

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[slimjim]

Both bruiserjeep and Hawken rep, Welcome aboard!

[fryedaddy]

Bruiser,

Do lots of research before you pull the plug.

Several of the people you will be speaking with are reps/installers with many years of experience.

Pay no attention to the hype/figures each manufacturer gives in their brochures.

Conventional or Gasser, it will be hard to determine but if you stay with the name brands you can't go wrong.
Get feedback from actual customers before you buy anything and a reputable dealer is a must!!!!

[bruey]

Maybe it's just me but when I looked at the new units, they were just coming out when I put mine in, too much work. Cleaning the unit every week and making sure the wood is dry. I opted for the old type boiler, burn poor wood that might be somewhat rotten when it's warm and the good wood when it gets cold. I always cover my wood , it's just better to burn dry vs damp. As far as the fire going out, no it won't , the boiler will fire and keep the water within your thermostat settings it just won't heat the house till your blower kicks on on your furnace. Hope that helped. I will add that I have been burning for 5 years now and the only mistake I made was taking 2 years to decide if I should put one in and what type. Should have been doing this for 7 years not 5. I can't begin to tell you how much you will enjoy having a warm house and not worrying about what it's costing you the entire time.

[Roger2561]

Maybe it's just me but when I looked at the new units, they were just coming out when I put mine in, too much work. Cleaning the unit every week and making sure the wood is dry. I opted for the old type boiler, burn poor wood that might be somewhat rotten when it's warm and the good wood when it gets cold. I always cover my wood , it's just better to burn dry vs damp. As far as the fire going out, no it won't , the boiler will fire and keep the water within your thermostat settings it just won't heat the house till your blower kicks on on your furnace. Hope that helped. I will add that I have been burning for 5 years now and the only mistake I made was taking 2 years to decide if I should put one in and what type. Should have been doing this for 7 years not 5. I can't begin to tell you how much you will enjoy having a warm house and not worrying about what it's costing you the entire time.

bruey - Unfortunately some of us don't have that option.  In my state (NH) I have no choice, I have to go with the gasser (EPA II compliant).  I know may other posters are in the same boat. 

FYI - I do not clean mine every week.  I have figured out that every couple of weeks works just fine for me.  And then it takes about 30 to 40 minutes.  Over the length of 2 weeks, 30 to 40 minutes is nothing.  I clean it early on a Saturday morning; say 6:00am.  By 7:00am I'm back indoors enjoying the warmth of the house, enjoying the heat and not hearing the oil burner run.   

Like you, I wonder why I wait so long.  It's the best investment I've ever made.  I was spending over $5,100.00/year for fuel oil.  Now, I'm spending about $600.00/$700.00 a year for firewood.  I get mine log length due to not having a wood lot.  Roger       

[Coyote556]

Bruey,

What kind of boiler are you running?

[oaky]

Whatever brand of OWB you feel right to purchase, you'll be glad you did purchase one. I purchased my first one 13 years ago, during those 13 years, I have never once regretted it. Saved a bundle on LP, paid for itself 5 times over. I'm one of those guys that enjoy working with making my own firewood, although now, I have a logging truck deliver oak logs to me every other year, then I block & split it up in my yard. Loading it up once in the morning & again in the late afternoon was never a chore to me.

My next OWB purchase in the next couple of months will be Portage & Main BL2840.

If my information is correct, on January 15, 2015, buyers will no longer be able to purchase a conventional burning OWB, I may be wrong...

Good luck bruiserjeep on your future OWB purchase.