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[Uponthehill]

I'm going to try and get further along on my house install.  Shop working GREAT !   My wife says my priorities are mixed up.   I disagree.  Anyway, I have a 150' run of Logstor from boiler to house.  Enters house ~ 3' higher than boiler.  Going to use a plate exchanger to Xfer heat.  Here are a few questions I have that would help me make some decisions on a design.  I may have additional questions, so I'll apologize for any additional questions.   Thanks in advance for anyone's input.   Stay warm....

* HEAT EXCHANGER
        Has anyone ever bought / used a plate exchanger from GEA ?  Here is a link to size their plate exchanger ---> http://flatplateselect.com/site/pub/login.aspx?ReturnUrl=%2fsite%2fDefault.aspx
        If not, what brands are well known ?  These GEA plate exchangers are too $$$.   Called about a 50 plate.  Somewhere ~ 800.00 !!!
*  GOING TO BUILD MY OWN HEADERS
       What is the optimal spread between 1" x 1/2" copper tees.  Should I just solder the T's with ~ 1" pipe between each T ?
       Will include zone valves.  Taco has a nice looking zone control module.
       May be a silly question, but does the pump run constant ?   I will assume not due to 'dead heading' the pump when no zone is calling for heat.  Control module actuates pump when a zone valve opens ?
*  OPEN vs. CLOSED systems
       Does anyone run a cast pump in an open system ? 
       What are the pros / cons vs. the Taco Bumble Bee ( Delta T ) vs. Grundfos Alpha ( Delta P ) ?
*  SIZING THE PRIMARY LOOP TO HOUSE FROM BOILER
       Basically figure head for 300' of Logstor plus any fittings and plate exchanger.  Size pump for whatever gpm the plate exchanger suggests ?
       Use stainless or bronze pump for this loop or would a cast pump last many years ?
       This pump would run constant....
*  SIZING PUMP FOR CLOSED LOOP ( house )
      Add up all loops for all zones and figure head for the 1/2" pex for all zones.  Plus all fittings.
      Take this total amount of head and combine with 1/2 gpm for each loop ?   I was told that 1/2 gallon per minute is enough for each 1/2" pex loop.
      Say I have 8 loops.  This would be a 4 gpm pump at the figured head pressure ?

[Jwood]

Let me help you save some money
 http://www.freeheat4u.com/Water-to-Water--Brazed-Plate_c_45.html

[Jwood]

50 plate for 189 I believe

[Jwood]

I'm also running a completely open system running a cast iron alpha pump with around 300' total loop

[Uponthehill]

So your OWB is 150' from your house like mine ?   Do you go through a plate exchanger as well ?  Would it be OK to PM you my info to maybe discuss your setup in detail ?   Thanks for your posts....

[Jwood]

I'm not running a plate exchanger at all and yeah you sure can pm me your info also I am probably 130 ft Boiler to the house.

[EE Farm Boy]

Sounds very similar to my setup.  First at the boiler I used a Taco 013 to pump 150' through logstor into the basement.  Followed by filter, guage and then into my heat exchanger.  I used a bell and gusset BP410-30MT, I oversized considerably 400,000 BTU's and I think it was around 400.00. I ordered everything online through  Supply House.  SS pumps on the open side, cast iron Taco 10 on the closed loop side.  Bronze Taco 3 for the DHW.  I have zone valves and a controller to operate the upstairs heat, downstairs heat, MB tile floor, garage heat.  I did not tie my taco 10 into my controller as I have manual value allowing the heated water to flow to the DHW exchanger all of the time.  I use an aquastat to turn the DHW circulating pump on when the water in the tank gets below 120 degrees in the hot water tank.   Take a look at my post as I have pics of the complete setup start  to finish.  I am pleasee with my system, but never owning one of these before, they sure do eat the wood.... On my manifold, I did connect the supply side and the return side together with a ball valve this way in case I wanted open and allow water to flow I can, but I have it turned off when everything is working properly.

[Uponthehill]

Thanks guys for the posts. EE, I printed one of your post pics. Thanks. Your setup is almost identicle to mine. Pretty much the norm is a 50 plate. I have spoken to a GEA rep., and looked at Taco sizing, which both claim that their FPHX can supply ample BTU with fewer plates. My opinion is the more 5x12 plates you have should equal more BTU. Any thoughts B4 I purchase a FPHX?

[slimjim]

Sorry Uponthehill, I guess I missed this one. Yes pretty much any brand 50 plate will be fine, be sure to install Unions, drains, ball valves, temp gauges on each port in that order, a snifter valve and water feed in between the ball valves on the wood boiler loop will also prove handy if you ever need it as well.
  Main header should be 1 1/4, heat loops should be 3/4 and spacing between ports will not matter with zone valves, no the circ does not run constant, it is controlled by TT calling for heat, it opens the zone valve for that zone, the zone valve then has an end switch that makes connection when the zone valve opens and the end switch then pulls in the TT contacts on the zone control panel, when any zone in the relay makes, it sends 110 power to the circ, I like the Grundfos Alpha for this application.

[Uponthehill]

Great. Thanks for the information. One more question. The zone valves I've got have a 90 second cycle time and are spring load return to close. When 24V is applied, it take 90 seconds to open. When 24V is removed, it takes about about 15 seconds to close via spring closure. It takes about 20 seconds before I can blow any significant amount of air through the valve. Is this a common cycle time and will I have any trouble "dead heading" the pump for 20 seconds when a zone calls for heat?

[slimjim]

No, the end switch is what makes the TT connection to the relay and turns on the circ, the end switch only makes when the zone valve is fully open so it cannot deadhead the circ.

[Uponthehill]

Plumbing my filter bypass loop for primary loop back to boiler.  1" copper through the basement wall straight into circulating pump. Directly beneath pump is a bypass loop with the filter housing I ordered with 2840. I read somewhere online that this it is a good location for circ pump (just above the filter). I realize that the pump could theoretically get some debris, but I don't anticipate much if any. Has anyone ever plumbed this way or would anyone say this will not work properly for some reason?  I have unions and valves to isolate as well. Also, has anyone ever installed site glasses, or site ports for a visual water flow?  If so, where did you purchase?  Thanks again for all comments. Stay warm....

[slimjim]

Could you draw us a picture, I'm not sure I understand what you are asking?

[Uponthehill]

Trying to post a pic from my iPad but get this error.

An Error Has Occurred! The upload folder is full. Please try a smaller file and/or contact an administrator.

Would love to know an easier way to post pics. I have several pics I'd love to share...

[Shrek1112]

Put them on photobucket and post the link in the thread. This is a common occurrence.