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[Pointblank]

Does anyone know if the epa rules are applied to outbuildings? Curious if one is still allowed if its not used to heat the primary residence?  Say for example you just wanted to heat an outbuilding such as a detached garage or barn.

[mlappin]

From my recollection any residence requires a EPA approved stove as in a coal  or gasifier to heat a residence with a residence being defined as any structure that has sleeping quarters.

I installed a C500 last year to heat a 10,000sqft horse barn, the owner has no desire to heat the house as well as it’s super insulated and already has nat gas and a insert.

[E Yoder]

That's what I read too. The sleeping quarters defines it as residential, which brings in EPA regs.

[wreckit87]

Here I thought it needed to be a business. Thanks for clearing that up gentlemen!

[E Yoder]

I've heard all kinds of ideas about it floating around at shows (if you own a farm or business you're exempt, etc).
 If in doubt I'd look up the law and read it yourself. It's dry reading but not that bad.

[mlappin]

I've heard all kinds of ideas about it floating around at shows (if you own a farm or business you're exempt, etc).
 If in doubt I'd look up the law and read it yourself. It's dry reading but not that bad.

A farm shop. outbuilding, chicken coop, hog barn, dairy barn, veal barn, etc etc etc are all exempt, hook the house to it and it needs to meet EPA regulations. Indiana has there own law in effect, pretty much mirrors the federal one except you’re only allowed to run it from September 15th to May 15th which I thought was pretty generous of em.

Then of course some counties also have their own rules, the one east of me adopted 2020 regulations plus have a ton of other crap about x number of feet from the property line, x number of feet from the nearest neighbors residence, blah blah and it has to be located x number of feet from any insured structure blah blah blah and has to be behind the house, not beside or in front of, a lot of chicago democrats in that county.

[Pointblank]

Thanks for the replys guys. At some point in the future I'm considering scaling back on the firewood cutting. Got a 30x48 detached garage that I could probably heat on 2 or 3 cord a year and a conventional stove would make things quite a bit easier for me.

[wreckit87]

Man, you could buy propane for 2 lifetimes before that pay off...

[E Yoder]

Depends on what stove you buy.
To some degree I burn wood for the independence factor. I don't even know what propane prices are. That's a good feeling.

[wreckit87]

Assuming decent insulation in a 30x48, we're talking $3-400 a year worth of LP keeping it at 55 ambient in MN. I small stove like a C150 would still be oversized most of the year and have a lot of idle time, but let's say $6-7k once you buy the stove, underground, pump, HX, electrical, etc. Then add in the cost of cutting wood (we all know it's far from free), at $400/yr it'd take 20 years to break even and at that point you need a new stove again. Sure wouldn't catch me starting a chainsaw if that were my scenario

[Pointblank]

$300 to heat a 30x48 building? You realize I'm in Minnesota, right?
You'd be lucky to keep a fishhouse warm up here for $300 

[E Yoder]

$300 to heat a 30x48 building? You realize I'm in Minnesota, right?
You'd be lucky to keep a fishhouse warm up here for $300 

Lol!

[wreckit87]

$300 to heat a 30x48 building? You realize I'm in Minnesota, right?
You'd be lucky to keep a fishhouse warm up here for $300 

Yes I do, and so am I. If you think you can do it on 2-3 cord with a conventional stove at 50% efficiency, that's 25,000,000-37,500,000 BTU with good dry oak. Converted to LP at 95% efficiency with 86,500 BTU per gallon, we have 289-433 gallons of propane. I just got a "summer fill" quote yesterday for $.89 a gallon. You're welcome to do the math yourself, but mine says $257-385. The numbers don't lie

[Pointblank]

$300 to heat a 30x48 building? You realize I'm in Minnesota, right?
You'd be lucky to keep a fishhouse warm up here for $300 

Yes I do, and so am I. If you think you can do it on 2-3 cord with a conventional stove at 50% efficiency, that's 25,000,000-37,500,000 BTU with good dry oak. Converted to LP at 95% efficiency with 86,500 BTU per gallon, we have 289-433 gallons of propane. I just got a "summer fill" quote yesterday for $.89 a gallon. You're welcome to do the math yourself, but mine says $257-385. The numbers don't lie

OK, you got me, sign me up.
Never would have guessed you can heat 1500 sq ft  in Minnesota for $257 by simply switching to propane.
Here i thought i was saving money all these years by cutting wood.
I'll be sure to pass on this wealth of knowledge to my friends and family who are also mistakingly still burning wood.

Anyone interested in a Classic Edge 550 and a slightly used Stihl 440?  Might have 30 ton splitter I'd be willing to part with also.
Oh..... That $.89 a gallon propane comes with a lifetime guarantee right?   

[wreckit87]

Be a smartass all you want, I don't care. Aside from the crisis 5-6 years ago, when is the last time LP got above $1.30? Before I started burning wood, I was heating 2800 sq ft on about 1000 gallons a winter including DHW. My 1600 sq ft shop with 14ft sidewalls and two 12x12 doors will heat for $120/mo on electric which is equivalent in cost to $3 propane (so would cost about $450 a year at $.89 on LP if I had an LP boiler). A BTU is a BTU, no matter where it comes from and as my calculations above clearly show, 3 cord of wood at 50% efficiency is the same BTU output as 433 gallons of LP at 95% efficiency. If you disagree with scientific facts, that's just fine but you're wrong. Again, the numbers don't lie.